Keir Starmer - FoM now a red-line

Scrote

Well-known member
Looks like we're going to be stuck with the consequences of Brexit for a good while longer as Starmer rolls back on yet another pledge.

Are any of his apologists beginning to wonder if they backed the wrong horse yet?

Or is this still 4-D chess that normal folk wouldn't understand..?
 

Laughing

Well-known member
Exactly what Prisoner says. The red line is two fold. Firstly it will loose labour votes if they were to have that in a manifesto. Secondly, freedom of movement would only be realistic if we rejoined the single market. That isn't feasible in a single parliament. Also the tories are trying to push through the pacific membership which will make rejoining the CU/SM much harder and they are doing it, by their own admission, to screw labour over.
 

BoroFur

Well-known member
Looks like we're going to be stuck with the consequences of Brexit for a good while longer as Starmer rolls back on yet another pledge.

Are any of his apologists beginning to wonder if they backed the wrong horse yet?

Or is this still 4-D chess that normal folk wouldn't understand..?

He said he would support freedom of movement while Brexit negotiations were still ongoing. We've left the EU and no amount of our anger and disappointment is going to change things now. The country has been paralysed for 6 years due to Brexit.

Calling folk who support him 'apologists' isn't helping.

Let's get the Tories out and move on to better things (y)
 

Johnny Vincents Motorbike

Well-known member
i believe the issue is to win an election - get the tories out, banished forever i hope - then commence with getting ordinary folk, the vast majority of people on these islands back to a life with some controls, assurance and certainty.

attacking him on public outlets and social media only lifts the spirits of the tories and those who work everyday to stop a more socially inclusive government - there will be some who come on this thread and use it to further encourage splits and attacks - see if you can identify them !!.

the left and on the left of the labour party, know well that some of what a labour party leader says and does, isn't what we would want or agree with (and its the same with every labour leader in one form or another), however, Labour& starmer know that the left hate the tories and their supporters who have brought this crippling plague of misery to our doorsteps so much that they have little choice but to vote Labour at the next election (and in the main they will) - so to get the numbers to stack up, he and Labour are displaying credentials to those who left labour and voted tory - politics is about getting people to change their views and Labour & starmer want those voters back in the fold.

fighting about it now with him in public isnt going to be helpful - so i would ask that until the tories are banished to the burning hills of hell - we hold our tongues on publicly criticising labour or rather keep comments within your own group/trade union/clp meets etc etc etc.

it will take a little self discipline, but the rewards long term will be better.
 

exiledinboro

Well-known member
In 2020 Rachel Reeves made it clear Labour would not take Labour back into the EU. I know that because it was part of Labours October 2020 conference and any serious Labour supporter would have picked up on it

That’s 2 years of consistent Labour messaging and numerous Starmer interviews where he has ruled

There is no room for Starmer to now change his position. That means we DO NOT need to wait for a manifesto

If people want to believe he will take the UK back then 🤷🏻‍♂️

But if people really do believe their lives and others will improve but being inside the EU then we need to discuss if they wouldn’t be better placed voting the Tories who are apparently softening towards a Swiss style deal
 

Boroboyyo

Well-known member
He needs to win back the northern areas . Going full remainer isn’t going to help him at all .

People on here keep saying the leave campaign was nothing but immigration . Well if that’s the case it is evidently a big issue for a lot of people (understandable too ) . Announcing to people he intends to allow it again would go down like a fart in the lift .

I’m personally of the opinion that some immigration is a good thing for labour shortages , but it shouldn’t be effectively bringing in the population of a city every year . We’re projected to reach 75 million people despite being a small island . Roughly 70% of the country is farmland , 10 % is urban and the rest green space . At which point is it too much ? We would have to sacrifice even more green space to accommodate this . More housing , more pollution and more farming to feed more mouths

Freedom of movement resulted in a lot of one way traffic from eastern to Western Europe . It wouldn’t be a problem if it was more even . But it wasn’t . I personally think the former soviet satellite states should have been handled more progressively in terms of freedom of movement than they were . Allow freedom of movement fully when their economies caught up and free from the shackles of communism
 
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BoroFur

Well-known member
But if people really do believe their lives and others will improve but being inside the EU then we need to discuss if they wouldn’t be better placed voting the Tories who are apparently softening towards a Swiss style deal
Try telling that to JRM and the ERG mob. Tories will not support a 'Swiss style deal' in a million years.
 

exiledinboro

Well-known member
Try telling that to JRM and the ERG mob. Tories will not support a 'Swiss style deal' in a million years.

My point is if you want a labour government (which you claim to) then it’s clear you accept his position

However if you believe there’s a conspiracy theory to get elected then reverse it then quite honestly after 2 years of labour repeating over and over and over its brexit position I can’t be arsed listening to it any more

🤦‍♂️
 

BoroFur

Well-known member
My point is if you want a labour government (which you claim to) then it’s clear you accept his position

However if you believe there’s a conspiracy theory to get elected then reverse it then quite honestly after 2 years of labour repeating over and over and over its brexit position I can’t be arsed listening to it any more

🤦‍♂️
Who believes there's a conspiracy theory? Not me.

 

SuperStu

Well-known member
fighting about it now with him in public isnt going to be helpful - so i would ask that until the tories are banished to the burning hills of hell - we hold our tongues on publicly criticising labour or rather keep comments within your own group/trade union/clp meets etc etc etc.

The trouble is that'll be never won't it. Starmer's Labour may win an election, they'll get 5 or 10 years, which they'll waste doing as little as possible cause they're scared of upsetting the tabloids and then it'll be on to our next 20 year tory stint. This is the problem with incrementalism. There's never going to come a time where the conditions are right for someone like Starmer to make the big changes we need.
 

festa5

Well-known member
Try telling that to JRM and the ERG mob. Tories will not support a 'Swiss style deal' in a million years.

Of course they won't. In fact I think they've already moved to quickly distance themselves from that rumour.

Save your breath though. Exiled is either an idiot or is intentionally disingenuous. Either way he's not worth the effort, best ignored.
 

exiledinboro

Well-known member
Of course they won't. In fact I think they've already moved to quickly distance themselves from that rumour.

Save your breath though. Exiled is either an idiot or is intentionally disingenuous. Either way he's not worth the effort, best ignored.

Festa part of the Starmer cult who doesn’t actually realise this has been Labours position for 2 years so resorts yet again to insults

🤦‍♂️
 

Chris_Boro

Well-known member
Any rowing back of Brexit is just not feasible going into the next election, it's too soon and would give the Tories a platform to grandstand.

Brexit was a massive mistake but it's happened and any attempt to undo that so soon would be a huge risk.

Unfortunately, to win the type of super majority required to overturn Brexit is going to mean the people of the UK continue to suffer the consequences.
 

BoroFur

Well-known member
The trouble is that'll be never won't it. Starmer's Labour may win an election, they'll get 5 or 10 years, which they'll waste doing as little as possible cause they're scared of upsetting the tabloids and then it'll be on to our next 20 year tory stint.
Can you give me next week's lottery numbers or tell me who's going to win Strictly?

Yes, that's how absurd your tantrums are starting to sound.
 
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