Messi looks finished

festa5 said:
Does him like a kipper.

He thinks (as did probably most people watching) that once Messi turns away from him he's going to try and cut across him and get a shot away on that left foot. It's that direction switch from Messi to go back down the line on the outside that does for him. Just doesn't read it at all.
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The way he shields the ball is exceptional as well, all down to his incredible control and balance. Gvardiol keeps pace with him comfortably but if he attempts to win the ball it's a pen.
 
Uwefuchs said:
Go and look at the teams and players who were playing in Seria A during Maradona's Napoli era. The standard was ridiculously high, it was literally a who's who of the best players in the world. Calling them a bunch of drunks is totally ignorant.
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Seria A was the top league in europe Napoli was the best and worst club for him. Napoli and its people were looked down upon as the worst of the wrost by the rest of Italy, which suited maradona's us and against the world attitude. Unfortunately because of his success and love of the club, he was treated like a god by its people, there was no respite from this. At the same time the underworld at napoli took him under their wing, and thats when it went pair shaped with drug addiction.
For me he skill levels were above anyone else including Messi at his peak, he was like Messi with dribbling, but was so much physically stronger on the ball, he would have no trouble adjusting to the modern game he was kicked from pillar to post, so i think his success would be even greater with modern day player protection.
 
It's pointless trying to compare Messi with Maradona in my opinion. Just be grateful as a football fan we've had the luck of seeing an all time great in action for 15 years. Messi makes the game look easy. I don't particularly care if Argentina win the World Cup, but it would be fitting if Messi was able to produce one more top performance that enable them to win.
 
Nano said:
Kante won the league with unfashionable Leicester, then the league again with Chelsea, the champions league and a world cup. Great player but not the best ever because team achievements don't define an individual.

The World Cup is knockout football. You don't have to be the best to win.

Maradona was before my time so I'm relying on video. He was clearly incredibly talented but he was lucky to be playing in an era where footballers weren't always professional. His lifestyle could cope playing against drunks. He wouldn't last long at the top three days with his lifestyle against the athletes of today. Tactics have changed and everyone is much more disciplined. Messi has been the best player, playing against tougher opponents for longer.

1 knockout cup final will not define his career. He is the best player of all time whether his team wins or loses. Would be nice to see him score the winner just to remove the argument but it really is irrelevant. This is his 2nd final and will probably his 2nd World Cup Golden Ball. That's impressive even if he doesn't actually get his hands on the trophy.
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Imagine how good Maradona would be if he had the training and lifestyle of the players of today!!!

Its all relative. He was head and shoulders above everyone else in his era.

Messi edges it for me as he's done it so consistently over a much longer period but as someone else said, peak Maradona was probably better than peak Messi.
 
JaenBoro said:
Imagine how good Maradona would be if he had the training and lifestyle of the players of today!!!

Its all relative. He was head and shoulders above everyone else in his era.

Messi edges it for me as he's done it so consistently over a much longer period but as someone else said, peak Maradona was probably better than peak Messi.
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But if you look at it like that (Peak v Peak) then other people have to be in the conversation. Peak Ronaldo (Brazilian), Ronaldinho, George Best etc were all the best players in the World for a period of time but their lack of longevity removes them from the conversation. And if you are selecting on longevity so narrowing it down to the few (Messi, Maradona, Pele, C Ronaldo) then comparing their peaks does Maradona's World Cup performance in 1986 (assuming that was his peak) really trump Messi's 91 goals in 2012?

I know it's an impossible question and there is no definitive way of proving things. I just think Messi has won everything there is to win at club level several times over, broke all sorts of records, had international success (with potentially more to come), 7 Ballon d'Ors etc and all while being a professional, not being a cheat, not taking drugs (performance enhacing or recreational) and staying in peak fitness for all that time. Looking at Maradona's Honours list I was surprised how little he won in his career. The best players find a way of winning, not just turning up when they want to.

Players like Maradona, Best, Ronaldo, Gazza get looked at romantically. What could have been if they didn't have injuries, drink/drug problems etc? Messi is what happens when ability and attitude combine (and you don't get any bad injuries). The others are what happens with ability on its own.
 
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