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Smoggle

Well-known member
Maybe. but it appears to me we are sleepwalking into a dictatorship in this country too. The government is slowly but steadily removing our freedoms one by one. Some action needs to be taken before it's too late. We look on countries like Kazakhstan and practically scoff at their authoritarian regimes whilst ignoring the fact we are turning into the same. And we are a much smaller country than Kazakhstan.

Our government are absolutely awful and will abuse and rig the system to keep their snouts in the trough and their mates in power. I still believe there are enough checks in place to prevent us heading anywhere near a dictatorship, the UK has many issues and it may not look pretty just now, but it really is so far removed from the autocratic thugs in power in much of Central Asia.
 

SmallTown

Well-known member
Our government are absolutely awful and will abuse and rig the system to keep their snouts in the trough and their mates in power. I still believe there are enough checks in place to prevent us heading anywhere near a dictatorship, the UK has many issues and it may not look pretty just now, but it really is so far removed from the autocratic thugs in power in much of Central Asia.
I’m genuinely not sure how far removed it is.
We are allowing the checks and balances to be eroded
 

Smoggle

Well-known member
I’m genuinely not sure how far removed it is.
We are allowing the checks and balances to be eroded

When protesters are gunned down by police without any comeback. When opposition parties that stray an inch from the official line are banned and their leaders exiled, jailed and murdered. When any dissenting voices like activists or journalists are silenced. When the entire wealth of the nation is siphoned off and money spent on vanity projects. When there are monuments and national holidays to Johnson as father of the nation. When that looks likely then we might not be far removed. Yes we need to protect our democracy, but I still maintain a lot of crazy things would have to happen to get to anywhere near a dictatorship.
 

SmallTown

Well-known member
When any dissenting voices like activists or journalists are silenced. When the entire wealth of the nation is siphoned off and money spent on vanity projects.
We really are closing on on these two alone. Once it happens it'll be very quick that the rest occurs as well as we will be unable to stop them
 

Smoggle

Well-known member
We really are closing on on these two alone. Once it happens it'll be very quick that the rest occurs as well as we will be unable to stop them

I disagree, we’re nowhere near what’s happened in many post-soviet countries and other dictatorships. I get the impression we’re on the same side, but I have been living under post-soviet dictatorships and islamic shariah-law theocracies since 2013, as well as travelling through many other similar countries, and I just can’t get on board with the UK being anywhere near those places, even with the current crop of atrocious politicians we have.
 

SmallTown

Well-known member
I disagree, we’re nowhere near what’s happened in many post-soviet countries and other dictatorships. I get the impression we’re on the same side, but I have been living under post-soviet dictatorships and islamic shariah-law theocracies since 2013, as well as travelling through many other similar countries, and I just can’t get on board with the UK being anywhere near those places, even with the current crop of atrocious politicians we have.
NO you're right. It's just that's the way we are heading. That's what worries me. We may be a long way off but we are going down that road. I'm concerned if we can't address it soon
 

Smoggle

Well-known member
NO you're right. It's just that's the way we are heading. That's what worries me. We may be a long way off but we are going down that road. I'm concerned if we can't address it soon

Yes, I’m watching from a distance and see the utter incompetence and lies of the UK government. There have been so many scandals that would have brought down a government at any other time, it’s worrying and I absolutely agree we need to be vigilant. I was never a big Corbyn fan and I’m not a big Starmer fan (there are very few politicians I warm too) but I’d be delighted to have either in government over the Bullingdon Boys. Like I said, I have faith we won’t lurch into absolute authoritarianism, but that doesn’t mean the current situation should be welcomed, democracy needs protecting at all times.
 

changingman

Well-known member
When protesters are gunned down by police without any comeback. When opposition parties that stray an inch from the official line are banned and their leaders exiled, jailed and murdered. When any dissenting voices like activists or journalists are silenced. When the entire wealth of the nation is siphoned off and money spent on vanity projects. When there are monuments and national holidays to Johnson as father of the nation. When that looks likely then we might not be far removed. Yes we need to protect our democracy, but I still maintain a lot of crazy things would have to happen to get to anywhere near a dictatorship.
Whilst I agree that this isn't an accurate reflection of the UK, I find it worrying that we're moving TOWARDS this, rather than AWAY from it!

It's almost as if the thought of any sort of modern, progressive, liberal society seems a pipe dream at present.

EDIT: "it's bad but it could be worse" has never worked for me as an excuse, and I've seen it used a lot by others over the past couple of years.
 

Laughing

Well-known member
Whilst I agree that this isn't an accurate reflection of the UK, I find it worrying that we're moving TOWARDS this, rather than AWAY from it!

It's almost as if the thought of any sort of modern, progressive, liberal society seems a pipe dream at present.

EDIT: "it's bad but it could be worse" has never worked for me as an excuse, and I've seen it used a lot by others over the past couple of years.
I like to think, Changingman, that the backlash the government are suffering at the moment, demonstrates that we, as a society, wouldn't stand for what is going on.

The tories are toast at the next election.
 

Smoggle

Well-known member
Whilst I agree that this isn't an accurate reflection of the UK, I find it worrying that we're moving TOWARDS this, rather than AWAY from it!

It's almost as if the thought of any sort of modern, progressive, liberal society seems a pipe dream at present.

EDIT: "it's bad but it could be worse" has never worked for me as an excuse, and I've seen it used a lot by others over the past couple of years.

It can always be worse, Kazakhstan is not Turkmenistan. However, we’re nowhere even approaching these nations and I can’t see us getting near that. We may have chancers and corrupt politicians, but we’re not on the path to a Rahmon, Niyazov, Aliyev or even the ‘benign dictator’ Nazarbayev.

Also, on your last point, it does work because quite simply it is far worse in many places, we are not heading that way even if things do get worse, hyperbolic language and comparisons hurt rather than bolster that argument.
 

Smoggle

Well-known member
Absolute standard Russian tactic that they’ve used loads of times - “hybrid warfare” - whether it’s a prelude to an attack I’m not sure. The weather is still pretty up and down over here so fighting in wintery conditions or melting snow/mud might not be optimal. There’s talks going on too so could just be to send a message to those involved…
 

Rauko

Well-known member
lol .. I'm as anti-Tory as the next guy - but to suggest our shower of sheet are in the same ball park as those in Kazakhstan etc is just .. :LOL:
 

SmallTown

Well-known member
lol .. I'm as anti-Tory as the next guy - but to suggest our shower of sheet are in the same ball park as those in Kazakhstan etc is just .. :LOL:
Why? They are heading that way. I guess we are conditioned to have a parochial view of the world, where English speaking countries and the west = good and asia = bad
 

Smoggle

Well-known member
Why? They are heading that way. I guess we are conditioned to have a parochial view of the world, where English speaking countries and the west = good and asia = bad

I have to disagree again smalltown. Parochialism exists but anglophone good, asia bad is too simple.

Firstly, the major anglophone countries are democracies - yes, democracy is being tested at the moment, and many anglophone and western countries have very dark histories we need to continue to address - but ultimately, these nations are among the most free, open and fair. Even now.
Secondly, we can all pick out successful Asian countries like Japan, but the reason much of Asia is seen as undemocratic is because it is just that. Now, the current, often authoritarian regimes and leaders may trace power back to colonial hangovers like the Soviet Union and European empires, or they may be due to theocracies or monarchies, but where democracies have emerged, like in Kyrgyzstan, they are far more fragile than anything we are experiencing.

The tories are awful, some are immoral and corrupt, and some would fit very snugly into an authoritarian regime, but I honestly think the majority respect democracy and the rule of law, even if I fundamentally disagree with what they stand for. I’ve read a fair few ‘hot takes’ from left commentators over the years where certain authoritarian countries get off very lightly, and the left aren’t alone in getting close to dodgy regimes… politics is dirty… that said, whether a Labour or Tory government, I don’t think our democracy is going anywhere, but I concede we need to keep a close eye on the current crop of tories and make the move away from populism to more honesty… easier said than done, however, if Trump gets re-elected along with populist tories here, maybe I’ll be a bit more worried.
 

Randy

Well-known member
Activity has ramped up. Americans believe an attack on Kiev to overthrow the government is imminent. Poland also now on high alert after the cyber attack on Ukraine last week.
 

Ex Footy Legs

Well-known member
The Russians have conducted war games and large troop movements for years, there doesn’t seem much concern amongst expats here in Москва and I don’t think ordinary people here want a war at all. I’m not packing my bags just yet! Putin will most likely be posturing to gain concessions, it will all be tied in with nordstream and Belarus.

Russia is never as powerful as some fear it is, yet it’s never as weak as others think it is. These threads pop up on here regularly saying Putin will invade so maybe one time they’ll be right, a small incident could lead to an escalation I suppose. I’ve said it before, but if you want information from real experts then the podcasts by Brian Whitmore (The Power Vertical) and Mark Galeotti (In Moscow’s Shadows) are indispensable.
My job dictates that I keep a close eye on geopolitical events like Russia and I’ve been pouring over peter pomerantsev’s podcast, Brian Whitmore (The Power Vertical) and Mark Galeotti (In Moscow’s Shadows.
Have to say, the mark galeotti and Peter pomerantsev podcasts are quite superb but Brian whitmore is average in comparison
Mark and peter really know their stuff!!
 
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