Ivan Toney on taking the knee...

Steer said:
Taking the knee raised the profile of the issue. It is in danger of becoming the "norm", and is lessening impact as time goes on. It is now just something that happens before a sporting event. Taking the knee was never in itself going to solve the problem, but invites conversations around the issue.

Maybe it is time to to think about what to do next.
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That's a good point. When Kapearnick (sorry no idea how to spell his name) did it it really did spark a debate and raise the issue to the surface. Nowadays it seems a bit futile. I have no issues with it but I think it should just be personal choice. The rugby is interesting. Some players take the knee and seem don't. Also it's not exclusively black or white players.
 
SmallTown said:
Seems to be his MO.
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Oh look here's small-town... Can talk on here but couldn't find a suitable car on his thread zzzz.

If posting things and having an opinion on them causes debate then is that not what a message board is about. You all just love back slapping on here and love everyone to agree with you.

Same gang all the time backing each other up like the school bullies used to.

Thankfully I can have an opinion and not need to follow the crowd unlike some one here.

And as for writing "this" under a post... Jesus wept how old are you.
 
Piccadilly Day Tripper said:
I don't really know what you want Chris? You agree that racism is not acceptable but rail against a visible peaceful gesture that shows a group of people, a whole profession, saying its time for change.

As it happens, I think footballers are being used as puppets and political punching bags now, because its easier than trying to answer their tough questions. I wonder if the taking of the knee would have had more impact and jolted authorities into action if it was done while more fans were more regularly in the stadiums.

If I was a black footballer who had suffered racist abuse from the dregs of society I'd be feeling very let down right now. Not 'oh well, we tried, suppose we're just going to have to shut up and get on with it.'
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So basically you're saying you agree with what I said then.
 
I'm not sure about his comments about 'being used like puppets'. It's not the TV companies that have brought it in. Although I'm not overly convinced by Sky splashing logos everywhere. I feel its a bit more 'look at us'.... Maybe I'm just cynical.

It was a right c*ck up with Boro. We had some on one knee and some standing. I guess the new boys didn't get the memo. I watched one game in the week were they kicked off and then blew the whistle to take a knee. So had to restart again😂. I'm not sure either side were going to do it.

It's not working. I heard someone say its like the clap for the NHS. You did it for a month and it was great but 2 months later yoh stopped. It didn't mean you had changed your mind.

It's done absolutely nothing. I just think it's made it worse as social media is showing us. It's just given racists new ammunition to use. I'm sorry but taking a knee or a sky slogan won't change how a racist feels or acts. I hate the phrase 'it's about education'. These are often grown men who would have been educated by now if they wanted to be.
 
S7DiscoDown said:
I'm not sure about his comments about 'being used like puppets'. It's not the TV companies that have brought it in. Although I'm not overly convinced by Sky splashing logos everywhere. I feel its a bit more 'look at us'.... Maybe I'm just cynical.

It was a right c*ck up with Boro. We had some on one knee and some standing. I guess the new boys didn't get the memo. I watched one game in the week were they kicked off and then blew the whistle to take a knee. So had to restart again😂. I'm not sure either side were going to do it.

It's not working. I heard someone say its like the clap for the NHS. You did it for a month and it was great but 2 months later yoh stopped. It didn't mean you had changed your mind.

It's done absolutely nothing. I just think it's made it worse as social media is showing us. It's just given racists new ammunition to use. I'm sorry but taking a knee or a sky slogan won't change how a racist feels or acts. I hate the phrase 'it's about education'. These are often grown men who would have been educated by now if they wanted to be.
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I cannot disagree with a word you have put there and in reality no one should be able to but some will I'm sure.

The gesture raised awareness and should have been done for a few weeks and the next steps should have followed but all they've done is continue with the knee and then comments at the start of each game by the commentators.

It has changed nothing other than to put it in the papers a lot more and that's about it. It's headlines one day and forgotten the next.

You will not change a racist person from being a racist person unless they want to change. Much like with everything in life if someone has no desire or motivation to change then they won't change.
 
ChrisTheRed said:
I cannot disagree with a word you have put there and in reality no one should be able to but some will I'm sure.

The gesture raised awareness and should have been done for a few weeks and the next steps should have followed but all they've done is continue with the knee and then comments at the start of each game by the commentators.

It has changed nothing other than to put it in the papers a lot more and that's about it. It's headlines one day and forgotten the next.

You will not change a racist person from being a racist person unless they want to change. Much like with everything in life if someone has no desire or motivation to change then they won't change.
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Were still talking about it months later though, isnt that the point of it?

Regardless it seems to really wind up the racists, so im all for it continuing
 
JM14 said:
Were still talking about it months later though, isnt that the point of it?

Regardless it seems to really wind up the racists, so im all for it continuing
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Ah well so long as we're talking about then that's all good.

We could talk about it forever... But talk is cheap.
 
Piccadilly Day Tripper said:
I suppose its the 'I was right all along, you can't change anything' attitude of your posts.
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That comes from people immediately dismissing you on here over the months really because your opinion doesn't match theirs and well it really should because well that's how life is for them so it should be like that for everyone.
 
jam69 said:
So what do you propose?
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Do you not read?

I've said work need to be carried out to seek out the perpetrators and deal with them robustly... That should include working with the social media organisations (who should be made to fund this) and also as mentioned by others a potential social media "black out" with the stars removing their accounts.

I'm not an expert in this field so sadly I can't provide a blow by blow account of what should happen which I think is what you're angling at so that you can then sit and pull it to pieces.

But if you agree that taking the knee and simply talking about it is changing anything then you're mistaken.
 
ChrisTheRed said:
If posting things and having an opinion on them causes debate then is that not what a message board is about. You all just love back slapping on here and love everyone to agree with you.

Same gang all the time backing each other up like the school bullies used to.

Thankfully I can have an opinion and not need to follow the crowd unlike some one here.
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I think what comes off a bit odd to me Chris is the vibe of your posts makes out like you're expressing really controversial opinions that you're constantly attacked for, but then the actual opinion turns out to be nothing like that.

E.g. you don't think footballers taking a knee before matches achieves anything... and boro haven't been taking a knee before matches all season.

E.g. you don't think we'll finish top 2... and boro haven't been in the top 2 all season.
 
Also I don't think you can really accuse Small Town of being in a school bully style gang on here. He actually is often on his own defending his take on things.
 
SuperStu said:
I think what comes off a bit odd to me Chris is the vibe of your posts makes out like you're expressing really controversial opinions that you're constantly attacked for, but then the actual opinion turns out to be nothing like that.

E.g. you don't think footballers taking a knee before matches achieves anything... and boro haven't been taking a knee before matches all season.

E.g. you don't think we'll finish top 2... and boro haven't been in the top 2 all season.
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Those debates stem from seeing people write the opposite on here. People saying we're still on for the top two etc. Am I not allowed to disagree with that?
 
I would at taking the knee has done more to draw the spotlight to continuing racism both within sport and the wider society, on its own it won't go far but there's no doubt its brought the issue to a wider attention and kept it there.
Theres a need for more "robust " action and if that does happen then the BLM protest should be credited as a catalyst.
Sad that some people seem to be more outraged at those kneeling than the continuing racism
 
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