Has YOUR life improved under Lord Ben Houchen?

[NoloBoro]

Don't disagree at all....except maybe the last sentence. But what are Labour's plans? Except pointing out what a mess we're in after 15 years of the Tories, what are the plans to get us out of this? We hear sound bites saying more money into the NHS, more money into infrastructure, nationalise the railways, etc, etc...... but where is the money coming from? Anybody can say what sounds good but if you can't afford it its nothing but a pipe dream.

I'm going to buy the old Debenhams store and turn it into the world's largest Hooters bar!

Hooters? Hopefully there’ll be one t*t looking for work tomorrow

 

[Andy_W]

I want Teesside Airport to continue trying to become profit making as per the plan. If the plan fails then there is a real argument about its future.

If the Malaga and Tenerife flights happen, that would appeal to many more people, some going on their yearly holiday.

Newcastle Airport was losing a shed load of money not so long back and were bailed out by an investment firm for around £100m. I personally think a NE International Airport would be better, somewhere in-between Newcastle and Middlesbrough, on a metro & rail line, somewhere in-between the A19/A1. Newcastle Airport being the other side of Newcastle would have made the argument against Teesside even greater. But whilst there is a current plan for Teesside I will contunue to use it and support it. It's a great little airport that is on the up.

TA is still ~100m in the red though, and still lost money last year (£-5m). Could have invested that 100m in the stock market and made ~£8-10m a year, every year on average, with less risk than an airport. Or paid off some debt and not be shelling out 5% per year in interest.

Would love to see the actual business plan for it, tried to find it but can't see anything.

If it didn't "work" enough to survive a recession in 2008, then it's just not going to work.

I get what you're saying about Newcastle, but they've now got a 14 year head start since the recession and more people to supply (include Sunderland to as NA is far easier to get to for them), Newcastle's success is Teesside's cost etc, and hard to get that back after 14 years. The investment at Newcastle over that 14 years will be massive compared to Teesside, very hard to fight that.

NA is badly positioned (for us), but I think you can get to NA via the Metro. TA is very close to the Darlington main line, but to make use of that it needs rail fares to be cheaper for people further away, and regular connections into TA from Boro/ Darlington etc. They could ditch the MSG stop, and open the TA one, and then maybe have electric carts for people to use to get from the station to the airport and vice versa, or a shuttle bus.

I want it to make sense, and I'm trying to get it to make sense but there's not a lot going for it.

To get it to work it needs to be a hub for RyanAir or Easy Jet etc, and must have a link to Manchester or Heathrow, but how do we get those from other airports near cities, with better infrastructure at the airport and transport links already in place?

 

[ThatFragranceGuy]

TA is still ~100m in the red though, and still lost money last year (£-5m). Could have invested that 100m in the stock market and made ~£8-10m a year, every year on average, with less risk than an airport. Or paid off some debt and not be shelling out 5% per year in interest.

Would love to see the actual business plan for it, tried to find it but can't see anything.

If it didn't "work" enough to survive a recession in 2008, then it's just not going to work.

I get what you're saying about Newcastle, but they've now got a 14 year head start since the recession and more people to supply (include Sunderland to as NA is far easier to get to for them), Newcastle's success is Teesside's cost etc, and hard to get that back after 14 years. The investment at Newcastle over that 14 years will be massive compared to Teesside, very hard to fight that.

NA is badly positioned (for us), but I think you can get to NA via the Metro. TA is very close to the Darlington main line, but to make use of that it needs rail fares to be cheaper for people further away, and regular connections into TA from Boro/ Darlington etc. They could ditch the MSG stop, and open the TA one, and then maybe have electric carts for people to use to get from the station to the airport and vice versa, or a shuttle bus.

I want it to make sense, and I'm trying to get it to make sense but there's not a lot going for it.

To get it to work it needs to be a hub for RyanAir or Easy Jet etc, and must have a link to Manchester or Heathrow, but how do we get those from other airports near cities, with better infrastructure at the airport and transport links already in place?

Think there are now buses that go to Teesside airport

But yes the metro takes you straight into the terminal

Or you can drive and pay parking

Or just get a taxi

Any time I've gone away and priced up Teesside it hasn't even been close. In another thread I picked some destinations and priced up some trips for a family of 4 and the savings were pretty large to use Newcastle or Leeds, where it was close they had better flight times or options and no layovers

I'd happily drive to Manchester if it saved us £200 after costs, so Newcastle is no problem at all, even for £50. I'd rather spend that while I'm away

 

[motownjunk]

TA is still ~100m in the red though, and still lost money last year (£-5m). Could have invested that 100m in the stock market and made ~£8-10m a year, every year on average, with less risk than an airport. Or paid off some debt and not be shelling out 5% per year in interest.

Would love to see the actual business plan for it, tried to find it but can't see anything.

If it didn't "work" enough to survive a recession in 2008, then it's just not going to work.

I get what you're saying about Newcastle, but they've now got a 14 year head start since the recession and more people to supply (include Sunderland to as NA is far easier to get to for them), Newcastle's success is Teesside's cost etc, and hard to get that back after 14 years. The investment at Newcastle over that 14 years will be massive compared to Teesside, very hard to fight that.

NA is badly positioned (for us), but I think you can get to NA via the Metro. TA is very close to the Darlington main line, but to make use of that it needs rail fares to be cheaper for people further away, and regular connections into TA from Boro/ Darlington etc. They could ditch the MSG stop, and open the TA one, and then maybe have electric carts for people to use to get from the station to the airport and vice versa, or a shuttle bus.

I want it to make sense, and I'm trying to get it to make sense but there's not a lot going for it.

To get it to work it needs to be a hub for RyanAir or Easy Jet etc, and must have a link to Manchester or Heathrow, but how do we get those from other airports near cities, with better infrastructure at the airport and transport links already in place?

The business plan is online, the original business plan is only available via wayback machine.
From the original plan the key points are :
"Recruitment for a commercial partner by March 2019;■ Purchase of the airport by March 2019;■ The attraction of 10 additional routes by 2022; of which: • 50% are chartered; and• 50% are scheduled.■ The attraction of a low cost carrier by 2022;■ The increase in freight tonnage up to 500 tonnes per annum by 2023;■ The tenfold increase in passenger numbers by 2023, of which:• 25% are business passengers• 75% are recreational passengers ■ Increase the propensity of Tees Valley residents to fly to the national average of 3.41 flights per annum"

Bearing mind the passenger numbers in 2018 were 142,000, a ten fold increase would be 1,420,000 in 2023 the actual number was 226,000. The airport has failed massively on every level according to the original business plan. Both the original and newer business plan say that if the airport fails then the land would be sold, probably for housing, to repay the loans ran up to support the airport.

 

[atypical_boro]

You might be slightly confused, Ben Houchen has actually bought the old Debenhams store in Middlesbrough via the undemocratic Middlesbrough Development Corporation. As for Hooters bar, would anyone put it past him?

Middlesbrough town centre could do worse than Hooters to get folk using it again. The one in Nottingham has been there decades. The one in Liverpool doing well and I’ve no doubt the one at Salford Quays will be a success once it opens.

 

[Mustoes boots]

My life has improved enormously i can now go to Hartlepool from Redcar down the magic tunnel, I can get treated at the state of the art Houchen Hospital, I personally have 7000 of the new Teessworks high paid jobs and I can go anywhere in the world with the hundreds of flights leaving the airport every day.

 

[Andy_W]

The business plan is online, the original business plan is only available via wayback machine.
From the original plan the key points are :
"Recruitment for a commercial partner by March 2019;■ Purchase of the airport by March 2019;■ The attraction of 10 additional routes by 2022; of which: • 50% are chartered; and• 50% are scheduled.■ The attraction of a low cost carrier by 2022;■ The increase in freight tonnage up to 500 tonnes per annum by 2023;■ The tenfold increase in passenger numbers by 2023, of which:• 25% are business passengers• 75% are recreational passengers ■ Increase the propensity of Tees Valley residents to fly to the national average of 3.41 flights per annum"

Bearing mind the passenger numbers in 2018 were 142,000, a ten fold increase would be 1,420,000 in 2023 the actual number was 226,000. The airport has failed massively on every level according to the original business plan. Both the original and newer business plan say that if the airport fails then the land would be sold, probably for housing, to repay the loans ran up to support the airport.

Yeah I've seen something related to 2018, but not actually seen any projections of when it turns to profit, what the profit is and what the passenger numbers are projected to be each year.

I've had a look on Houchen's page and the link to the business plan doesn't work, it's a lost 123-reg page.

• Stop the airport from closing in 2021 - easy, if you throw enough cash at it
• Secure a new low-cost airline - not really, and it's now 2024, which airline?
• Secure ten additional routes by 2022 - not really, it's 2024, there are only 5 destinations this week (a busy week)
• Achieve 1.4 million passengers by 2029 - 23 was 30%, even if he maintains 30% increase YOY it's about 1m
• Drive the creation of 7,600 jobs and add £420 million to our local economy each year - lol
• Return the airport to profit - 2024, still losing £5m per year
• Scrap the hated £6 passenger fee - meaningless
• Stop the planned 350-home development - we need houses, could have built 5,000 on there

I would be absolutely amazed if they were able to sell the land for housing, and not have to give the previous owners a massive cut. Thinking you can also buy cheap land from private individuals, bend planning laws to build houses, and to inflate land values is probably also illegal. I would love to be able to buy up some land on the cheap and then assume I'm going to get planning on that, and not have to pay the previous owner, it's practically impossible.

Labour have conceded the Mayor race though, so at least it's going to be interesting.

Lets see what the next few years bring for him, a few investigations I expect. Can see him dishing out a lot of blame to the new labour MP's, councils etc we will be getting. When little of it works, or is proven not to be good value, it's going to be the fault of Labour of course.

 

[Jonny_Rondos_Disco_pants]

Yeah I've seen something related to 2018, but not actually seen any projections of when it turns to profit, what the profit is and what the passenger numbers are projected to be each year.

I've had a look on Houchen's page and the link to the business plan doesn't work, it's a lost 123-reg page.

• Stop the airport from closing in 2021 - easy, if you throw enough cash at it
• Secure a new low-cost airline - not really, and it's now 2024, which airline?
• Secure ten additional routes by 2022 - not really, it's 2024, there are only 5 destinations this week (a busy week)
• Achieve 1.4 million passengers by 2029 - 23 was 30%, even if he maintains 30% increase YOY it's about 1m
• Drive the creation of 7,600 jobs and add £420 million to our local economy each year - lol
• Return the airport to profit - 2024, still losing £5m per year
• Scrap the hated £6 passenger fee - meaningless
• Stop the planned 350-home development - we need houses, could have built 5,000 on there

I would be absolutely amazed if they were able to sell the land for housing, and not have to give the previous owners a massive cut. Thinking you can also buy cheap land from private individuals, bend planning laws to build houses, and to inflate land values is probably also illegal. I would love to be able to buy up some land on the cheap and then assume I'm going to get planning on that, and not have to pay the previous owner, it's practically impossible.

Labour have conceded the Mayor race though, so at least it's going to be interesting.

Lets see what the next few years bring for him, a few investigations I expect. Can see him dishing out a lot of blame to the new labour MP's, councils etc we will be getting. When little of it works, or is proven not to be good value, it's going to be the fault of Labour of course.

Low cost airline - Ryanair are in

Routes - Logan air had Newquay, Belfast, Dublin and s few others but pulled them.