Passing out from the back

Merlin

Merlin

Well-known member
Are you 👍🏻 or 👎. I find it a very hard watch at times i must admit - if it’s done well like some of the top teams do then it’s clearly works effectively, but we seem to cause ourselves quite a lot of problems with it sometimes. I think our build up play needs to be much quicker in general next season to mount a serious promotion challenge. Just my opinion 🧐
 
Most definitely a (y), but we have to realise with injuries and poorer players in the team (or players who lack that particular ability) that we can't do it all of the time or even every game.
Carrick knows that hence why we saw more pragmatic approaches in games such as Leicester, however sometimes he's quick to revert to our 'identity' when we just don't have the personnel. The spell around the Chelsea second leg where we lost Lath, Coburn, Jones and Bangura showed that without pace and the ability to stretch teams and open the pitch up you just can't play out from the back.

The recruitment in the summer has to be players who suit our style. When people say we need quality over quantity it needs to be players who are comfortable receiving the ball and have pace (Aaron Ramsey for instance).
But we also need the back up of players who can play the wing back system when we're playing better teams or have injuries and that's why we need to sign players like Ayling as well.
 
Quicksilvera said:
Risk vs reward 👍
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Risk obviously increases when you don't have your best players on the pitch. While we've had our struggles at times we've done really well considering our injuries this season and when you look at how the top teams are trying to throw it away you can't help wonder what could have been if we'd stayed injury free and signed another striker.
 
👍🏻

Much better than lumping it on to the head of there CB like we did under Pullis and Warnock.

I know we messed it up Vs Hull, but I do think it allows us to create more in general. But as said above needs to be measured and adapted depending on what’s happening on the pitch. Think we have been slow to mix it up in many games this season
 
I'm not sure that first choice England keeper Jordan Pickford chose the best situation to pass out from the back last night. Or that he will have been much consoled by Sean Dyche. Even the best keepers with the most skilful players in front of them get it wrong quite often. Alisson for instance. Seny Dieng chose badly with O'Brien but why did O'Brien appear to offer himself when under pressure? The keeper (not the receiver of the pass) can see the whole situation and it's down to the keeper to pick the right time.
 
I get it but there has to be Plan B aswell. If you do it all the time you become predictable and invite the high press and that can have disastrous consequences just like at Hull.

I see the risk and reward aspect but that doesn't mean you have to be rigid and inflexible to the point of shooting yourself in the foot because you won't change
 
I like it a lot but agree with the need to be flexible. You need intelligent players as well as technical players to do it.

Massively oversimplifying things, but I'd say you need a plan A of playing out the back and a plan B of being slightly more direct and putting into space for the likes of Jones and Lath to run onto. And ideally you should be able to alternate that in game in response to what the opposition are doing.

If they're pressing really high and it's causing a problem, if you start pinging it over them into space they'll drop off a bit and you can resume doing it.

It's about players reading the situation as much as anything else.
 
I'm a yes if we have the players capable of doing it, trying to force it on players who can't is defensive suicide.
 
I don’t have any issues with it. Decision making / execution of how and when we do it are the key things.

People always remember the negative things and mistakes. Playing out from from the back has led to many goals throughout Carrick’s Tenure.

Hackney / Howson were sublime for us at times last year. Hackney has been a huge miss. Even when he has returnred he’s never looked fully match sharp. Hopefully an injury free pre season can get him back to those heights next year.
 
Yeh, lets sack off trying to play football and sucking in teams to press us so we can counter attack, lets just go back to Pulis flat back 10 and hoof it to the lone striker, that was much more entertaining
 
This was the main reason why Villa were successful at the Emirates on Sunday. They used Martinez as an outfield player and created overloads when Arsenal pressed.

It's a very risky approach, but the rewards are there to see.
 
Lim a big (y) as longas we have the right players in the team.

Pro's, when done well:
- commits opposition players to the press, and takes away their energy levels later in the game
- starves the opposition of the ball limiting their ability to build any pressure and play into the game
- the opposition either have to isolate their striker to press, or commit midfield or maybe even full press. That either leaves lots of midfield space free or an opposition with a high line which can be exploited.


It only works if :

- your goalkeeper is intelligent and good with feet
- your CBs are composed and have a bit of vision
- your CM are good at receiving under pressure and making the right decisions
- you have pace high up the pitch


If any of these components are missing, we struggle. I'm a big believer that we have to get players to fit the system, so people like Barlaser and Fry have to leave, and that we need to occassionally switch it up with a longer pass out from Dieng, to keep the opposition guessing. But as a rule 80% of the time we should play out. Away from home, we maybe need to do it a little less, especially early in games.
 
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