Ronald 750 goals

red_harrington said:
Interesting - you got any stats to back that up?

Or just guessing
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Nope, I actually saw plenty of games, so not sure why you want to be cocky or unless you think football was invented in the last twenty years or so.

Which you probably do coz I remember you recently picking me up on a point about classic players and you said that Maradona and Cruyff played in 'black and white'.

Strange that you want to pick people up on points but hey ho.
 
Not being cocky, just not that keen on people making stuff up and putting it out there like it's a fact

A bit like that "b/w Maradona & Cruyff" - you're making things up again :rolleyes:
 
red_harrington said:
Not being cocky, just not that keen on people making stuff up and putting it out there like it's a fact
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Certainly sounds like it. There is a wondrous thing called You Tube. You can find all sorts of things on there too, including great players on muddy pitches, getting the crap kicked out of them. And there are books too. Is that cocky enough of a reply?!
 
It has to be said, it is overwhelmingly the general consensus of pretty much every football pundit, journalist or ex player I've ever heard that in the 60s, 70s and 80s it was harder for skillful attacking players than it is now, and easier for a cynical defender to get away with it.
I don't have any stats or facts to back that up, though I do know it is a matter of record that fifa made a conscious decision to fine tune the laws of the game to help and protect aforementioned skillful attacking players after the lowest ever scoring world cup in 1990.

Cos of all the above I'd always go Pele and Maradona as the two finest players ever. Pitches weren't nearly as good in them days either.
 
The Card Cheat said:
It has to be said, it is overwhelmingly the general consensus of pretty much every football pundit, journalist or ex player I've ever heard that in the 60s, 70s and 80s it was harder for skillful attacking players than it is now, and easier for a cynical defender to get away with it.
I don't have any stats or facts to back that up, though I do know it is a matter of record that fifa made a conscious decision to fine tune the laws of the game to help and protect aforementioned skillful attacking players after the lowest ever scoring world cup in 1990.

Cos of all the above I'd always go Pele and Maradona as the two finest players ever. Pitches weren't nearly as good in them days either.
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Exactly! This is what I was trying to say but was being pulled up for whatever reason!

I remember watching Cruyff play in the flesh when I was a young un and he was cut to ribbons when he came off and the ref did nothing. Still the best player I've ever seen and the fact that he just go on with it, made him even better in my eyes.
 
The Card Cheat said:
It has to be said, it is overwhelmingly the general consensus of pretty much every football pundit, journalist or ex player I've ever heard that in the 60s, 70s and 80s it was harder for skillful attacking players than it is now, and easier for a cynical defender to get away with it.
I don't have any stats or facts to back that up, though I do know it is a matter of record that fifa made a conscious decision to fine tune the laws of the game to help and protect aforementioned skillful attacking players after the lowest ever scoring world cup in 1990.

Cos of all the above I'd always go Pele and Maradona as the two finest players ever. Pitches weren't nearly as good in them days either.
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You don't have any stats to back that up because the stats would not and do not back that up :cautious:

Nobody is saying things weren't rougher and pitches tougher but that does not equate into being harder to score.

If a defender lunges in with a two-legged challenge for instance, if you skip away from it you're in space, leaving the defender on his ****. These days defenders stay on their feet more, making it harder for a forward to get past.

Defensive tactics have improved too, meaning it's way more difficult for teams to carve out a goal.

The playing skills of defenders in general is way better than in the past, they're more ball-playing footballers than knucklehead bully boys of yesteryear.

It's all very well for pundits & journalists to say it was 'tougher' in the olden days, in fact it may well have been, but that doesn't mean to say it was harder to score - and the stats back that up.
 
red_harrington said:
You don't have any stats to back that up because the stats would not and do not back that up :cautious:

Nobody is saying things weren't rougher and pitches tougher but that does not equate into being harder to score.

If a defender lunges in with a two-legged challenge for instance, if you skip away from it you're in space, leaving the defender on his ****. These days defenders stay on their feet more, making it harder for a forward to get past.

Defensive tactics have improved too, meaning it's way more difficult for teams to carve out a goal.

The playing skills of defenders in general is way better than in the past, they're more ball-playing footballers than knucklehead bully boys of yesteryear.

It's all very well for pundits & journalists to say it was 'tougher' in the olden days, in fact it may well have been, but that doesn't mean to say it was harder to score - and the stats back that up.
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You're right the stats show that teams historically scored more goals. That's to be expected as teams played in a much more attacking way, often with 5 forwards. However that doesn't mean it was easier for individuals to score goals.
In fact any kind of logic would suggest its obvious that playing at a time when defenders were allowed to kick the **** out of you on pitches like a plowed field would definitely be harder for a skillful attacking player.
Correct me if I'm wrong but this is pretty much universally backed up by players, managers and journalists who are in a much better position than me to give their opinion.
Not that it really matters in the grand scheme of things!
Also I have nothing but respect and admiration for players like Ronaldo and particularly Lionel Messi.
 
But as you say so yourself, if teams play with 5 forwards then it means they have less defenders... which can only mean one thing: it's easier to score :)

Opinions & 'logic' doesn't come into it, just stats & facts.
 
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