Industry on Teesside...

ThePrisoner said:
Home chargers are slow so you would only be able to have a couple of customers a day. And what would the customer do for the 10 hours his car is charging? 🤡
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You keep saying home chargers are slow. Which means you've still failed to grasp the "EV owners do other things" whilst they charge their car.

It's painful sometimes. I don't think you're too dumb to understand the concept but you seem to be struggling.

So let's break it down for me, if I had a home charger. I charge my car once a fortnight. So that would be 27 times I could lease my spot out every two week (supposing I lease it to someone who charges whilst at work and a local who needs charging overnight). That would be a nice little earner might even pay for my own fuel. If I could get some solar and some batteries installed it'd be even more lucrative.
 
SmallTown said:
The Prius isn’t an EV. They are tropes I’m afraid. You might not think they are but I’ve seen the mainstream media feeding these mistruths to you guys and have had to correc them time and again.

Glad you mention the leaf, the original one was poor, was a first gen vehicle and is probably used by the anti EV crowd as a great example of how EV don’t work. I suggest you look at current EV, such as the Hyundai GMP platform cars or, well, the new leaf to form your opinions. Using the leaf as an example is like me not wanting a TVR because the Model T was slow…

I don’t see how needing to know where chargers are makes EV not viable? So no one uses a sat nav?
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Nissan sold a dud and duped the public so I should trust them that the next one isn't? One bitten, twice shy and all that. Human nature again.

I'm not so much bothered by GMP EV platforms as GMP platform prices. Is it even at market yet or just another thing in development?

https://www.hyundai.com/worldwide/en/brand-journal/ioniq/e-gmp-revolution

As I said, the mere fact than an app exists and is needed to hunt down chargers means that the charging infrastructure is inadequate. Joe Bloggs just wants to know that there is a charging station within 50 miles when the little orange blinky fuel light comes on in his car.

What are your circumstances of EV use? I'm getting vibes of a company car user that charges at motorway services or at the place of work because of heavy subsidies. Is that the case?
 
ThePrisoner said:
Nissan sold a dud and duped the public so I should trust them that the next one isn't? One bitten, twice shy and all that. Human nature again.

I'm not so much bothered by GMP EV platforms as GMP platform prices. Is it even at market yet or just another thing in development?

https://www.hyundai.com/worldwide/en/brand-journal/ioniq/e-gmp-revolution

As I said, the mere fact than an app exists and is needed to hunt down chargers means that the charging infrastructure is inadequate. Joe Bloggs just wants to know that there is a charging station within 50 miles when the little orange blinky fuel light comes on in his car.

What are your circumstances of EV use? I'm getting vibes of a company car user that charges at motorway services or at the place of work because of heavy subsidies. Is that the case?
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Nissan didn’t “sell a dud” though. They sold a first generation product. Which is the best in class at the time.

Yes the GMP platform is at market. And it has excellent range and charging times. There are various Hyundai, Genesis and Kia models on sale which use it.

Again the app thing is kind of wrong, I guess it just shows lack of willingness to advance on your part. Everyone uses sat nav these days so using technology to navigate us just a thing.

And no, you are very wrong about my use profile. If you’d listen you would have seen that I charge once a fortnight. Hardly conducive to long motorway mileage is it? You’re the one telling me I don’t have enough range 🤣
 
SmallTown said:
Nissan didn’t “sell a dud” though. They sold a first generation product. Which is the best in class at the time.

Yes the GMP platform is at market. And it has excellent range and charging times. There are various Hyundai, Genesis and Kia models on sale which use it.

Again the app thing is kind of wrong, I guess it just shows lack of willingness to advance on your part. Everyone uses sat nav these days so using technology to navigate us just a thing.

And no, you are very wrong about my use profile. If you’d listen you would have seen that I charge once a fortnight. Hardly conducive to long motorway mileage is it? You’re the one telling me I don’t have enough range 🤣
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The Sinclair C5 was also best in class at the time.

Of course I use sat nav to navigate and have been doing so for years. Never, ever have I used it to find a petrol station.

So where do you charge? You say it take less than 15 minutes so it must be a DC charger?
 
ThePrisoner said:
The Sinclair C5 was also best in class at the time.
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Correct. I’m sure you have a point. But you haven’t made it yet
ThePrisoner said:
Of course I use sat nav to navigate and have been doing so for years. Never, ever have I used it to find a petrol station.
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so using an app is a standard part of driving? Interesting it’s back to being hypocritical I guess. Using an app is only a problem if it’s an EV ap.
ThePrisoner said:
So where do you charge? You say it take less than 15 minutes so it must be a DC charger?
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When I travel to the North East. Which I do about three times a year. Not my normally daily journey. I know, from your “empirical evidence” comment that you’re a fan of picking tiny, out of context bits of information and presenting them as the whole fact. But don’t do it when making things up about me please.
 
SmallTown said:
Correct. I’m sure you have a point. But you haven’t made it yet

so using an app is a standard part of driving? Interesting it’s back to being hypocritical I guess. Using an app is only a problem if it’s an EV ap.

When I travel to the North East. Which I do about three times a year. Not my normally daily journey. I know, from your “empirical evidence” comment that you’re a fan of picking tiny, out of context bits of information and presenting them as the whole fact. But don’t do it when making things up about me please.
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You keep evangelising for EVs but based largely, if not entirely, on your own experience. In other words, anecdotal.
It would be useful to know what your circumstances are and if they are typical of most car users or if you are an outlier in terms of ability to buy an EV (cost) and access to charging.
 
SmallTown said:
You keep saying home chargers are slow. Which means you've still failed to grasp the "EV owners do other things" whilst they charge their car.

It's painful sometimes. I don't think you're too dumb to understand the concept but you seem to be struggling.

So let's break it down for me, if I had a home charger. I charge my car once a fortnight. So that would be 27 times I could lease my spot out every two week (supposing I lease it to someone who charges whilst at work and a local who needs charging overnight). That would be a nice little earner might even pay for my own fuel. If I could get some solar and some batteries installed it'd be even more lucrative.
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Most people are not doing 30 or 40 miles a week, more like 200 (200 per week = 10.4k per year) so most people would have far fewer than 27 slots.
Those slots which you would have available would probably be during the day as you would be using it to charge your own car overnight.
Potential customers would want yo use their car during the day, not have it tied to a charger for several hours while they sit on your garden wall catching some rays.
You would need to guarantee when your lease times are.
You would need a two car driveway or park yours on the street (if possible) or be elsewhere when the spot was being leased.
You would need to have liability insurance.
 
ThePrisoner said:
You keep evangelising for EVs but based largely, if not entirely, on your own experience. In other words, anecdotal.
It would be useful to know what your circumstances are and if they are typical of most car users or if you are an outlier in terms of ability to buy an EV (cost) and access to charging.
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Not really know. I only use my own experience because people arguing the strongest against it do so from a level of ignorance, such as you not grasping the concept of leaving car to charge whilst you do other things.
 
ThePrisoner said:
Those slots which you would have available would probably be during the day as you would be using it to charge your own car overnight.
Potential customers would want yo use their car during the day, not have it tied to a charger for several hours while they sit on your garden wall catching some rays.
You would need to guarantee when your lease times are.
You would need a two car driveway or park yours on the street (if possible) or be elsewhere when the spot was being leased.
You would need to have liability insurance.
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So, no, you don’t need to charge your car overnight every night. It’s very rare for that to be a need I imagine.

The catching rays bit. You STILL being ignorant of how people refuel their cars? I don’t know why you can’t grasp this concept. I said before i didn’t think you were stupid but your failure to understand this, no matter how many times I explain it gives one pause.

And as for the last comment. Yes. So?
 
My previous and current car combined cost less than the current cheapest EV. I had my previous car 10 years and will likely keep my current one 10 years

According to google maps there is one charging station with 4 charge points within 2 miles of me. The next nearest station is 5 miles away. I am not living in the sticks.

Here is a list of cheapest EVs:

Cheap electric car brands​


12 Cheapest Electric Car Brands UKCheapest ModelsStarting PriceBattery (kWh)Average Real Range (combined driving) in miles
1Cheapest Smart EVSmart EQ fortwo coupe£22,22516.760
2Cheapest MG EVMG MG4 EV Standard Range£25,99550.8185
3Cheapest Vauxhall EVVauxhall Corsa-e£28,55545.0175
4Cheapest Nissan EVNissan Leaf 39 kWh£28,99539.0145
5Cheapest Fiat EVFiat 500e Hatchback 42 kWh£29,43537.3145
6Cheapest Citroen EVCitroen e-C4£29,99545.0165
7Cheapest Mazda EVMazda MX-30£30,05030.0105
8Cheapest Peugeot EVPeugeot e-208£30,19545.0175
9Cheapest Hyundai EVHyundai Kona Electric 39 kWh£30,45039.2155
10Cheapest Mini EVMini Electric£31,00032.6110
 
SmallTown said:
Not really know. I only use my own experience because people arguing the strongest against it do so from a level of ignorance, such as you not grasping the concept of leaving car to charge whilst you do other things.
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But where are these places where you charge then go off and do other things? Apart from Rockcliffe spa.
Not at supermarkets. Not at retail parks. Not at places of work (a few virtue-signalling corporate gestures apart).

Maybe in Lahndan or a cuple of other metropoli for city workers? I wouldn't know but even if so it would be insignificant.
 
ThePrisoner said:
My previous and current car combined cost less than the current cheapest EV. I had my previous car 10 years and will likely keep my current one 10 years

According to google maps there is one charging station with 4 charge points within 2 miles of me. The next nearest station is 5 miles away. I am not living in the sticks.

Here is a list of cheapest EVs:

Cheap electric car brands​


12 Cheapest Electric Car Brands UKCheapest ModelsStarting PriceBattery (kWh)Average Real Range (combined driving) in miles
1Cheapest Smart EVSmart EQ fortwo coupe£22,22516.760
2Cheapest MG EVMG MG4 EV Standard Range£25,99550.8185
3Cheapest Vauxhall EVVauxhall Corsa-e£28,55545.0175
4Cheapest Nissan EVNissan Leaf 39 kWh£28,99539.0145
5Cheapest Fiat EVFiat 500e Hatchback 42 kWh£29,43537.3145
6Cheapest Citroen EVCitroen e-C4£29,99545.0165
7Cheapest Mazda EVMazda MX-30£30,05030.0105
8Cheapest Peugeot EVPeugeot e-208£30,19545.0175
9Cheapest Hyundai EVHyundai Kona Electric 39 kWh£30,45039.2155
10Cheapest Mini EVMini Electric£31,00032.6110
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Can you charge at home? That list doesn’t seem to have 2nd on it?
 
ThePrisoner said:
But where are these places where you charge then go off and do other things? Apart from Rockcliffe spa.
Not at supermarkets. Not at retail parks. Not at places of work (a few virtue-signalling corporate gestures apart).

Maybe in Lahndan or a cuple of other metropoli for city workers? I wouldn't know but even if so it would be insignificant.
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Supermarkets: Lidl, Asda, Sainsbury’s
Retail parks: Teesside park
Places of work: yes. oh dear you’ve assumed that wanting your employees to fuel their cars is “virtue signalling”

Given you’ve used the phrase virtue signalling and you’ve lied about supermarkets and retail parks in going to assume you write for the Mail!
 
Oh look another thread hi-jacked by an endless argument about EVs

So, Lucite, Mitsubishi, Cassel Works……or whatever name it is to different people, what happens next? From first hand experience I know that the end of the plant towards Haverton Hill Road is in a pretty poor state.

Is it to be levelled back to brownfield and re-used for another purpose?

There was talk of the electrolyte plant at the south end of the site expanding a few years back. But I heard that amongst other things historic ground contamination helped put an end to that.
 
Glover_elbow said:
IndeedView attachment 58748
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Hydrogen fuelled cars are a ridiculous idea. Build massive infrastructure to use electricity to make hydrogen to store under extreme pressures with the danger of leaks and explosions all to convert it into mechanical energy.

Fuel cells are even worse. Use electricity to split water into H2 and O2 in order to combine H2 and O2 to make electricity. Barking mad.

Bio-fuels are probably worse than fossil fuels in terms of land usage and destruction of habitat.

The current model for phasing out dinosaur juice for cars and replacing with electricity from the grid which has been produced from 'green' sources is the least worst option, if it can actually be made to work.

The best option is to discourage and penalise car use and ban it where possible and use public transport instead.
 
Back in the 70's my Dad had a company car that ran on LPG. Just looked it up and it is extremely clean and about half the price of petrol.
I wonder why this didn't become more of a thing and an alternative to EV's?
 
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