BBC2 - The Detectives: Taking down an OCG.
- Thread starter sambaDTR
- Start date
homesickblues
Well-known member
Some good police work going on and well done to those officers. Its a shame about a few who spoil the police reputation.
jeff_potato
Well-known member
I watched the third episode last night. I understand that every society has its pond life, but their arrogance is breathtaking.
I'm trying not to spoil it but there was one particular person in the third episode who left me astonished by their actions.
I'm trying not to spoil it but there was one particular person in the third episode who left me astonished by their actions.
Emmersons_BrazillianDong
Well-known member
Teesside most violent place per capita in the UK too. Its a scary prospect and we should be providing the resources needed to reduce crime to keep people safe - and by that I mainly mean the prevention of violence as well as tackling those involved.
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I once listened to a former high ranking police officer at a addictions conference. ( 2016 ish )
He was very involved in the pro - legalisation/ decriminalization school of thought.
He described being head of a drugs / OCG task force in part of Birmingham.
Spent millions of pounds , over 6 years gathering evidence, put through 50 + doors , total sentencing for those involved was 200+ years.
He stated it stopped the supply of class A ( heroin and crack .
For less than 4 hours.
Also the next set of OCG , were more violent than the last set . And that pattern has been repeated every time for over 30 years previously.
He was very involved in the pro - legalisation/ decriminalization school of thought.
He described being head of a drugs / OCG task force in part of Birmingham.
Spent millions of pounds , over 6 years gathering evidence, put through 50 + doors , total sentencing for those involved was 200+ years.
He stated it stopped the supply of class A ( heroin and crack .
For less than 4 hours.
Also the next set of OCG , were more violent than the last set . And that pattern has been repeated every time for over 30 years previously.
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Heam44
Well-known member
There is stuff like that happening every day, all over the UK (well certainly major cities and large northern towns etc, maybe not in the Cotswolds or wherever).
Emmersons_BrazillianDong
Well-known member
The 'War Against Drugs' has been a total and utter shambles.
Another local anecdote from a national trainer that I met in london two weeks ago- "many lives were being saved in Middlesbrough with their treatment plan for those with addictions to Heroin. PCC Steve Turner came in and stopped it because he didn't like how it looked - and now more people are dying"
I've not met either of them but this same guy had a lot of time for Barry Coppinger
To be fair, I do appreciate that its a political nightmare - but we need central government decisions that take brave stances and develop interventions that work.
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I know that service well , and they, your trainer , were absolutely right.
Middlesbrough has had some of the most forward thinking services in the country for two decades.
Politically, I think that the shift will only occur when the eldest generation of voters were of a generation that went raving.
Emmersons_BrazillianDong
Well-known member
I'd like to share his name as he was possibly the best trainer that I've had on this area of work but given I've shared some personal comments, I'll not do that. He's done an awful lot of work around the country to promote the use of Naxolone and he's worked a ton in Middlesbrough.
The session was delivered in Scotland Yard and as somebody who is not a cop - was amazing to see their responses to the session with a huge collective recognition that despite all of their incredibly hard work - its ultimately futile. I was hoping my generation might be the start of change but I agree with you that its still going to take some time - it might just be as I'm shuffling off. But one day - it has to change.
It was also sad to hear so many stories of my home town being discussed across the country in relation to the misery that is felt by so many individuals and their families.
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I'm 80% certain I know who he is.. he's a great speaker and great advocate for Naloxone.
I'm still hopeful that the Tories get that decimated, that ' substance use ' moving to a health issue will allow reform earlier than we both think.
Regards the program.. I'm still struggling with the greed of the top fella ..
Why didn't he just be legit on the takeaways ?
Declaring no income and posing with Lamborghinis is crazy
Nero
Well-known member
Exactly. The approach to organised drugs in Britain is never going to stop people using drugs, or extremely violent people organising the supply.
Politicians and authorities accept the status quo as mainly its poor people in deprived areas impacted by drugs. If it ever started taking over suburban areas where wealth is, it would become a hugh issue.
FatFrank
Well-known member
Whilst I echo your sentiments for providing resources to tackle this area of crime, I really do believe that it is one of those weeing into the wind elements that will just never get hold of, as stated above, like Everest there are just queues of criminals stood behind the next drug lord wanting their 15 minutes. It is no secret that drugs are ran by Albanian, Romanian and South American gangs infiltrating the UK. Despite technology become stronger, the criminals are always one step ahead. I spoke with a police officer 2 years ago as part of my job who stated that a large majority of "drug hauls" these days aren't even court worthy due to the quality of the substances. Some cocaine samples were found to have as little as 2% of cocaine-related substance evident - the majority made up with rat poison, paracetamol and vitamin powders. There is no law against selling an 8-ball of vitamin C - it just your next wannabe local lad wanting to make a quick buck.
I always chortle when I read that the Royal Marines (or other law organisation) capture say, 25kgs worth of cocaine floating in the sea, or aboard some beaten up fishing trawler. They're distractions from the 2500kg that is travelling into the UK from elsewhere. There has been a cocaine epidemic in the UK for as long as I have been an adult and aware of it, but unfortunately the powers that have the ability to even begin addressing the consequences of it are more often than not the actual end users of the product.
wilkos_perm
Well-known member
Decisions based on evidence should a no-brainer to implement, whatever the politics. My wife has had involvement with the programmes in M'Bro, professionally i mean, and was furious at the recent backwards steps taken recently
Heam44
Well-known member
That is illegal actually.
Offences such as -
Articles for Use in Fraud.
Offering to supply a controlled drug
Also, I can’t remember the exact offence but something to do with substances used to produce controlled drugs - cutting agents or whatever.
There will be other offences also.
Heam44
Well-known member
Regards to people points about the legalising drugs and treating them as a health issue. This is something that I would certainly be open to, and think it should be something we need to do more research into etc.
However I don’t believe the legalising of drugs would put a stop to organised crime however.
Firstly an illegal drugs market would still exist, whether it was cheaper drugs or stronger drugs and addicts purchasing illegal drugs to take along with the amounts they were prescribed on their prescription or whatever.
Also, the organised crime groups would move into other areas, stolen vehicles, modern day slavery, prostitution etc etc.
Lastly, dismantling organised crime groups is just as much about protecting vulnerable people (both children and adults) as it is about reducing drug use.
Although many a local drug dealer may be respected and admired on the streets / in the pub, with their nice tans, designer clothes, expensive cars and jewellery etc.
A large amount of them are total scumbags who exploit and bully vulnerable people into doing their dirty work for them, whether it be dealing drugs, storing and moving drugs and weapons, allowing the drug dealers to use their property etc.
That’s aside from the violence committed against other criminal, innocent parties such as the friends and family’s or their rivals or anyone else who happens to cause them a slight issue.
They also inflict untold misery on vulnerable people in other ways as well, many an adult who is fighting addiction will make significant progress on quitting drugs until they run into the local drug dealer who will give them free drugs / even posting it through the letterbox etc to get them ‘back on it’. The moral compass of these people is non existent.
The impact that these people have on the most vulnerable children in society is huge. Whether that is the children of the drug dealers (at each level), the drugs users, and any that they are exploiting. Drugs go hand in hand with child neglect and domestic violence.
These people have a far worse impact on society than most people know (even the people who believe that they ‘know what goes on’).
I’d love to show the ‘likely lads’ who look up to the local drug dealer, what the local drug dealer is really like (in many instances). How they neglect their children, exploit and bully vulnerable people (kids, adults and elderly), domestic violence against their partner etc etc
Rant over
However I don’t believe the legalising of drugs would put a stop to organised crime however.
Firstly an illegal drugs market would still exist, whether it was cheaper drugs or stronger drugs and addicts purchasing illegal drugs to take along with the amounts they were prescribed on their prescription or whatever.
Also, the organised crime groups would move into other areas, stolen vehicles, modern day slavery, prostitution etc etc.
Lastly, dismantling organised crime groups is just as much about protecting vulnerable people (both children and adults) as it is about reducing drug use.
Although many a local drug dealer may be respected and admired on the streets / in the pub, with their nice tans, designer clothes, expensive cars and jewellery etc.
A large amount of them are total scumbags who exploit and bully vulnerable people into doing their dirty work for them, whether it be dealing drugs, storing and moving drugs and weapons, allowing the drug dealers to use their property etc.
That’s aside from the violence committed against other criminal, innocent parties such as the friends and family’s or their rivals or anyone else who happens to cause them a slight issue.
They also inflict untold misery on vulnerable people in other ways as well, many an adult who is fighting addiction will make significant progress on quitting drugs until they run into the local drug dealer who will give them free drugs / even posting it through the letterbox etc to get them ‘back on it’. The moral compass of these people is non existent.
The impact that these people have on the most vulnerable children in society is huge. Whether that is the children of the drug dealers (at each level), the drugs users, and any that they are exploiting. Drugs go hand in hand with child neglect and domestic violence.
These people have a far worse impact on society than most people know (even the people who believe that they ‘know what goes on’).
I’d love to show the ‘likely lads’ who look up to the local drug dealer, what the local drug dealer is really like (in many instances). How they neglect their children, exploit and bully vulnerable people (kids, adults and elderly), domestic violence against their partner etc etc
Rant over
Parrothead
New member
The lad who was attacked with the axe, committed suicide on Monday (when the first episode was broadcast).
After all he had been through- it was sad to hear.
After all he had been through- it was sad to hear.
FatFrank
Well-known member
I stand corrected.
Heam44
Well-known member
I think he passed away back in June / July.