carragher, neville etc

T

TheWolfman

Well-known member
isn't it funny watching these hypocrites s***ing themselves about these Saudi takeovers and purchasing of top premier league players.

It's exactly as their clubs have done in the past but it was American owners. They've been siphoning players from portugal, spain and other countries for over inflated wages and signing on fees for years.

Russian money, American money now Saudi money we've seen it all before. Who cares if bernado silva runs off to saudi arabia, its basically the same as premier league clubs sniffing round championship players and flashing the cash.

Oh and basically what Salford are doing...

Unlucky lads theres some bigger boys in the playground.
 
I've got a lot of time for Neville and agree with many of his positions, but he looks a right nob suddenly calling out the big money coming from Saudi Arabia having previously taken fees from Qatar during the world cup, claiming that 'we need to go out there and demonstrate how the sport can be a force for change'. As if any Qatari or Emirati with money is going to give a ****. Now reality is coming to slap him in the face.

I don't think its right, but you can't dance with the devil for so many years then be surprised when he turns up to take it all away.
 
Not sure I agree with the OP.

Of course the integrity of football, like any major sport, is corrupted by money. That's a difficult one to unravel.

But this issue is about where the money comes from, it rather the purpose of the 'investment'.

It's right to be called out and a very different issue to American money, or the money invested in Salf, for example.
 
If the American state, its law makers and government, owned Liverpool then it might be similar but they don't. It is the unelected ruling families of UAE and Saudi who Man City and Newcastle.

That said I don't entirely disagree with your OP.
 
I don't think it is really much different to the Americans (or the Russians, Asians or whoever). The world is run by billionaires. It is run by them, for them. They don't earn their billions, other people earn it for them. Everything they have they have received through exploitation, even when it doesn't look like they have. Some of the human rights issues from places like Saudi are terrible but the abhorrent working practices of corporate America, exploiting people through the healthcare system, promoting gun usage, supporting things like Trump and his followers, even just being the sort of person that influences politics by donating to political parties like the Tories for personal gain is also reprehensible. I don't think there is such a thing as a good billionaire.

I know that even Gibson isn't perfect (not comparing him to the Saudis) but I will allow far bigger concessions for people like Gibson that are actually fans of the clubs but I don't think that is the case for any of the billionaire owners out there (American, Saudi or others). Gibson is in it for the right reasons, not just to make money or to sportswash.
 
Nano said:
I don't think it is really much different to the Americans (or the Russians, Asians or whoever). The world is run by billionaires. It is run by them, for them. They don't earn their billions, other people earn it for them. Everything they have they have received through exploitation, even when it doesn't look like they have. Some of the human rights issues from places like Saudi are terrible but the abhorrent working practices of corporate America, exploiting people through the healthcare system, promoting gun usage, supporting things like Trump and his followers, even just being the sort of person that influences politics by donating to political parties like the Tories for personal gain is also reprehensible. I don't think there is such a thing as a good billionaire.

I know that even Gibson isn't perfect (not comparing him to the Saudis) but I will allow far bigger concessions for people like Gibson that are actually fans of the clubs but I don't think that is the case for any of the billionaire owners out there (American, Saudi or others). Gibson is in it for the right reasons, not just to make money or to sportswash.
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For me the big difference is their positions of leadership. These are not billionaires FROM Saudi Arabia, they actually rule it and make the laws. Not something you can criticise the Glazers for, or even Abramovich really (even if he was Putin's pal of sorts).

But there is an over-arching question about 'who are the good billionaires'? Who are the billionaires we want to run the world's biggest football clubs who got so rich from all their charity work in Africa? For me, the Liverpool owners etc are the lesser of several evils at least.
 
atypical_boro said:
For me the big difference is their positions of leadership. These are not billionaires FROM Saudi Arabia, they actually rule it and make the laws. Not something you can criticise the Glazers for, or even Abramovich really (even if he was Putin's pal of sorts).

But there is an over-arching question about 'who are the good billionaires'? Who are the billionaires we want to run the world's biggest football clubs who got so rich from all their charity work in Africa? For me, the Liverpool owners etc are the lesser of several evils at least.
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Yes, I'm on board with the level of influence of the state vs business owners being something they can at least control. They are the evil-setters rather than just the evil influencers. I'm just of the opinion that lesser evils are still evils so I won't be championing one over the other. As I said above, I hope these evils wipe themselves out when they realise they can't compete with bigger evils with deeper pockets and we move towards having fair competition.

Think I said the word evil too many times haha.
 
TheWolfman said:
isn't it funny watching these hypocrites s***ing themselves about these Saudi takeovers and purchasing of top premier league players.

It's exactly as their clubs have done in the past but it was American owners. They've been siphoning players from portugal, spain and other countries for over inflated wages and signing on fees for years.

Russian money, American money now Saudi money we've seen it all before. Who cares if bernado silva runs off to saudi arabia, its basically the same as premier league clubs sniffing round championship players and flashing the cash.

Oh and basically what Salford are doing...

Unlucky lads theres some bigger boys in the playground.
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I could get behind this if their sentiment was more about human rights than about someone with deeper pockets than the owners in the PL and the impact it will have on Sky Sports.

Neville showed his true colours on that score when he went to Qatar.
 
Nano said:
Yes, I'm on board with the level of influence of the state vs business owners being something they can at least control. They are the evil-setters rather than just the evil influencers. I'm just of the opinion that lesser evils are still evils so I won't be championing one over the other. As I said above, I hope these evils wipe themselves out when they realise they can't compete with bigger evils with deeper pockets and we move towards having fair competition.

Think I said the word evil too many times haha.
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Just not sure they will wipe themselves out without taking the whole of football with them. There is a sort of 'hierarchy of evils' for me.

Cloughie used to complain about the motives of his chairman, Sam Longson, at Derby (as depicted in the Damned United but also in his autobiography). He was just some bloke who owned a road haulage business.
 
Jonny Ingbar said:
Not sure I agree with the OP.

Of course the integrity of football, like any major sport, is corrupted by money. That's a difficult one to unravel.

But this issue is about where the money comes from, it rather the purpose of the 'investment'.

It's right to be called out and a very different issue to American money, or the money invested in Salf, for example.
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How does it differ to someone like Neville and Beckham getting paid Qatari money and then him putting that into Salford.

Im sure a lot of these billionaires have been part of dodgy deals, cover ups to get where they are. As @Nano says the lesser evils are still evils.
 
TheWolfman said:
How does it differ to someone like Neville and Beckham getting paid Qatari money and then him putting that into Salford.

Im sure a lot of these billionaires have been part of dodgy deals, cover ups to get where they are. As @Nano says the lesser evils are still evils.
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If you're asking me if I think all of the billionaire club owners have made their money ethically, then no of course they havent. But that's a different point entirely.

The point here if why the Saudi state (not an individual, or commercial entity) are ploughing eye watering sums into sports, including football.

It's very straightforward, its explicit and its sportwashing.
 
Jonny Ingbar said:
If you're asking me if I think all of the billionaire club owners have made their money ethically, then no of course they havent. But that's a different point entirely.

The point here if why the Saudi state (not an individual, or commercial entity) are ploughing eye watering sums into sports, including football.

It's very straightforward, its explicit and its sportwashing.
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That’s it for me - this is a decision by leaders of the country.
Other money may be dirty but less dirty.

The OP having a go at Salford? You might as well have a pop at Gibson - local lad supporting his local team

And… I’d like to to think American and Saudi are a little different…. stonings, hangings, misogyny and murder of a journalist sets them apart.
 
Jonny Ingbar said:
If you're asking me if I think all of the billionaire club owners have made their money ethically, then no of course they havent. But that's a different point entirely.

The point here if why the Saudi state (not an individual, or commercial entity) are ploughing eye watering sums into sports, including football.

It's very straightforward, its explicit and its sportwashing.
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Its more than just sportswashing they want to take stakes in all manner of media, i think it comes down to power and control. The way they just trampled over golf was very telling they dont just want to partake in sport but rule it. I just wish as a country we wouldnt trade with them but we have been doing business with these countries for decades including selling weapons.
 
1finny said:
That’s it for me - this is a decision by leaders of the country.
Other money may be dirty but less dirty.

The OP having a go at Salford? You might as well have a pop at Gibson - local lad supporting his local team

And… I’d like to to think American and Saudi are a little different…. stonings, hangings, misogyny and murder of a journalist sets them apart.
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Im not having a go at Salford i'm having a go at the hypocrites that are not happy because a bigger entity has came in and upset their bosses and their super clubs.

I have no right to complain about Salford just as i didn't complain when we poured money in under Robson. We were blowing teams out the water with wages.
 
He wasn't bothered when the Saudi's came in at Newcastle, but now the Saudi's might take players away from the PL all of a sudden he takes issue with it?
 
Glover_elbow said:
Its more than just sportswashing they want to take stakes in all manner of media, i think it comes down to power and control. The way they just trampled over golf was very telling they dont just want to partake in sport but rule it. I just wish as a country we wouldnt trade with them but we have been doing business with these countries for decades including selling weapons.
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Just as sky did to the other smaller UK broadcasters who these hypocrites work for.
 
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