Coventry v Man Utd

Conscious I’ve liked just about every one of Sheriff and Viv’s posts so thought I’d add my contribution.

I really couldn’t give a 5hit whether VAR is right or not, or if it “corrects” borderline decisions, but it sucks the absolute life out of the game and needs to be binned - can you imagine the Coventry fans today - let down by a millimetre that a human wouldn’t spot.

I’m also not bothered about refs and linesmen making mistakes - it happens, just like players and managers make mistakes - part of the game.
 
Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
What impact does that have for our cup win though.

Zenden struck the ball twice. This was clearly shown on television. It was a clear and obvious error.

Do you still consider us to have won the trophy?

Of course there is going back. If you introduce something really stupid it's generally a good idea to stop doing the stupid thing.
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There wasn't VAR in place for our cup win - so it's a moot point. Dean Ashton would have been off in the 2006 semi if we had VAR. I don't have a time machine.

*You* think VAR is really stupid. But before it was introduced there was a weekly clamour for it. It has been badly implemented, but it does provide another means to overturn incorrect decisions that affect major turning points of games.

Just because it's detractors shout loudest doesn't mean they're the most numerous.
 
LaPennaBianca said:
There wasn't VAR in place for our cup win - so it's a moot point. Dean Ashton would have been off in the 2006 semi if we had VAR. I don't have a time machine.

*You* think VAR is really stupid. But before it was introduced there was a weekly clamour for it. It has been badly implemented, but it does provide another means to overturn incorrect decisions that affect major turning points of games.

Just because it's detractors shout loudest doesn't mean they're the most numerous.
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Don't you feel bad about having won something unfairly though?

VAR wasn't in place seems a cop out. Dodging the question.

And if you are using the "it all evens itself out" argument, well yes, it does. So what's the need in having VAR then.

I don't care what people are clamouring for. I'd rather ignore them.
 
For VAR to accurately make a decision like today the pitch would have to be laid out using laser alignment and it would need to be able to take into account expansion and contraction of the pitch from heat and moisture in real time. What is the margin of error in the VAR system?

VAR is a circus marketing gimmick. Get rid of it.
 
VAR is patchy at best, I suppose it is decisions like this it was bought in for "was it onside or offside", but it still dependent on human interpretation and they got it right today, unfortunately for Coventry but the other big decision from yesterday, the handball they got it so wrong, how much clearer can you get, the player had a clear sight of the ball and moved his arm to it. so for me VAR should only be used for off sides where a goal has been scored, that wouldn't help Coventry but it would bring the spontaneity back into the game where you probably would have a natural pause anyway.
 
Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
Don't you feel bad about having won something unfairly though?

VAR wasn't in place seems a cop out. Dodging the question.

And if you are using the "it all evens itself out" argument, well yes, it does. So what's the need in having VAR then.
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I'm not "dodging the question". You're creating a particular hypothetical situation to gain an admission that has nothing to do with my point. I have no idea how the rest of the final in 2004 goes if we don't score that pen. Neither do you. So it's a pointless argument. Would we have won the game if we still had the maximum wage? It's the same ahistorical argument.

My point is: today, VAR exists and it made the right decision. Today it stopped a goal that contravened the laws from being allowed to stand. I genuinely could not care less if that stopped Coventry City from having a great story.

Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
I don't care what people are clamouring for. I'd rather ignore them.
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And the reason we will still have VAR is because people with the power to make decisions will just ignore you.

Before it was adopted we had the argument "if we can see in the studio then surely the ref should be allowed to see these images". That doesn't go away.
 
Here's one for you. The VAR adjudicators can put the overlay line anyway they want, depending if Man U want an onside or offside decision. Just a little jiggle and Bob's your FA Cup finalist.
 
ThePrisoner said:
Here's one for you. The VAR adjudicators can put the overlay line anyway they want, depending if Man U want an onside or offside decision. Just a little jiggle and Bob's your FA Cup finalist.
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I don't get this either.

The powers that be would surely have preferred Coventry in the final.

It's far more marketable and far more exciting to have a second division side come from 3-0 down to win and reach a major final than have one of the usual suspects reach it.
It would have been one of the greatest wins in the competition's history.

If they were going to rig it, they wouldn't rig it for Man United.

If it wasn't for the international coverage of Saarbrucken's shock victories, I couldn't have even told you a single result in the German Cup this season.

I don't have a clue what's happened in the French or Italian Cups, I only know about the winner of the Copa del Rey because it was Athletic Bilbao's first trophy in 40 years and the post match scenes were incredible.
 
TeaCider said:
I don't get this either.

The powers that be would surely have preferred Coventry in the final.

It's far more marketable and far more exciting to have a second division side come from 3-0 down to win and reach a major final than have one of the usual suspects reach it.
It would have been one of the greatest wins in the competition's history.

If they were going to rig it, they wouldn't rig it for Man United.
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Oh bless you innocent child! No team from the PL will ever reach the FA Cup final until the year the PL teams withdraw from it.

So, 2027.
 
I think the new rule of there has to be clear space between last defender and the attacker is the way to go. It's clear and it's consistent. If that rule was in place today Coventry would of won it
 
ThePrisoner said:
For VAR to accurately make a decision like today the pitch would have to be laid out using laser alignment and it would need to be able to take into account expansion and contraction of the pitch from heat and moisture in real time. What is the margin of error in the VAR system?

VAR is a circus marketing gimmick. Get rid of it.
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That’s a huge amount of wrong. It doesn’t need laser alignment. The camera sees the lines and with a bit of maths knows exactly the angle of the camera and can figure perspective out
 
GibbosEmpire said:
I think the new rule of there has to be clear space between last defender and the attacker is the way to go. It's clear and it's consistent. If that rule was in place today Coventry would of won it
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Todays rule is clear and constant, it’s actually more constant and easier to be accurate than the “clear space” judgement
 
BoroMart said:
That’s a huge amount of wrong. It doesn’t need laser alignment. The camera sees the lines and with a bit of maths knows exactly the angle of the camera and can figure perspective out
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How true are the lines? How do they lay the offside line at exactly perpendicular to the touch line? There is error in *every* measurement but this does not seem to be taken into account. Most pitches aren't flat, they have crowns. How symmetrical are the crowns? If these VAR shithouses want to talk millimetres, then let's talk millimetres.
 
ThePrisoner said:
How true are the lines? How do they lay the offside line at exactly perpendicular to the touch line? There is error in *every* measurement but this does not seem to be taken into account. Most pitches aren't flat, they have crowns. How symmetrical are the crowns? If these VAR shithouses want to talk millimetres, then let's talk millimetres.
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The lines are based on calibration from the pitch lines. Its basic maths, the degree of error is so small that it’s imperceptible
 
So, summarizing this thread -

1. The standard of refereeing generally is terrible.
2. When decisions go for your team, it's just part of the game
3. When decisions go against your team, VAR should be introduced in the interests of fairness
4. With VAR, decisions are swayed by the relative size of the teams, so smaller teams are disadvantaged
5. VAR drains the atmosphere out of games because the spontaneity is removed
6. Therefore VAR should be abolished
7. Return to 1.
 
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