Ben Roberts...

Didn't know about Saha's goal either but still significant if it means they've stopped showing Di Matteo's effort.
 
atypical_boro said:
It’s amazing how many people forgot about Saha. A few of my mates (not on here) did too.

Roberts was definitely caught unaware but I think it’s a bit unfair to blame him as if it’s all his fault. Chelsea were a much better side than us and we weren’t good on the day really, all over the pitch.

Higgy has said numerous times that he was telling RDM to “hit it” (when he lost him) as he thought it would just sail over the bar.
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I’ve looked but can’t find the Di Matteo interview talking about the goal and Roberts positioning.

No one was saying it was all Roberts fault for us losing the final, the game was lost on the coach prior to the goal. Chelsea were the better team but Roberts must take some of the blame. It certainly gave us an uphill battle to fight with key players going off injured.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I’ve looked but can’t find the Di Matteo interview talking about the goal and Roberts positioning.

No one was saying it was all Roberts fault for us losing the final, the game was lost on the coach prior to the goal. Chelsea were the better team but Roberts must take some of the blame. It certainly gave us an uphill battle to fight with key players going off injured.
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Personally yes I’d say Rav was far more to blame, not just for the result but for the relegation too. As was Emerson. They were revered and acted like spoilt little brats.
 
atypical_boro said:
Personally yes I’d say Rav was far more to blame, not just for the result but for the relegation too. As was Emerson. They were revered and acted like spoilt little brats.
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I know this won't come as a shock to you, but I can't agree with you on that. Being involved in two cup runs and bad administration got us relegated.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I know this won't come as a shock to you, but I can't agree with you on that. Being involved in two cup runs and bad administration got us relegated.
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Well I agree with you in a way, but part of the bad administration was signing and over-paying huge wages to players who thought they were superstars but were actually nowhere near as good or consistent as they needed to be. Rav and Emo have 8 starts between them at international level across both their careers. We blew far too much smoke up their arses but I know it was a sign of the times. Just my opinion.
 
atypical_boro said:
Well I agree with you in a way, but part of the bad administration was signing and over-paying huge wages to players who thought they were superstars but were actually nowhere near as good or consistent as they needed to be. Rav and Emo have 8 starts between them at international level across both their careers. We blew far too much smoke up their arses but I know it was a sign of the times. Just my opinion.
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I don't care what we paid them, it was well worth it to see them play for my team.
 
atypical_boro said:
I’d say that about Juninho. The other two did far more damage to this club than good in my view.
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How old were you when Rav and Emerson played for us?

I have watched some great footballers play for the Boro and these two are up there with the best. Both of them put our club on the map at the time and made a lot of bigger clubs sit up and wonder what was going on. Liverpool even tried to poach Rav but that is nothing new with the scousers.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
How old were you when Rav and Emerson played for us?

I have watched some great footballers play for the Boro and these two are up there with the best. Both of them put our club on the map at the time and made a lot of bigger clubs sit up and wonder what was going on. Liverpool even tried to poach Rav but that is nothing new with the scousers.
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Well they took us down, in no small part to their attitudes. They were the “leaders” of the team and they didn’t respect their team mates, that much is virtually indisputable. Recipe for disaster.

I was in my teens and went to every home game, I started watching us when we were a lower division 2 side. I loved them at the time like everyone else but having listened to every interview, every podcast, read every article and book about 96/97, those two were absolute poison. Emerson in particular a player who totally wasted his potential and admits it. Rav may have helped the club progress in terms of facilities but so would Vialli and he would have done it without destroying everyone’s spirit in the process. I wish we’d signed him instead.
 
I remember reading the day after the cup final,Roberts saying he let the shot go past him because he thought it was going over. He also said "it dipped for fun" I remember being furious about it for years.
 
atypical_boro said:
Well they took us down, in no small part to their attitudes. They were the “leaders” of the team and they didn’t respect their team mates, that much is virtually indisputable. Recipe for disaster.

I was in my teens and went to every home game, I started watching us when we were a lower division 2 side. I loved them at the time like everyone else but having listened to every interview, every podcast, read every article and book about 96/97, those two were absolute poison. Emerson in particular a player who totally wasted his potential and admits it. Rav may have helped the club progress in terms of facilities but so would Vialli and he would have done it without destroying everyone’s spirit in the process. I wish we’d signed him instead.
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They didn't take us down, three points being deducted took us down.

Edit: We had two Rolls Royce players surrounded by Ford Fiesta parts.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
They didn't take us down, three points being deducted took us down.

Edit: We had two Rolls Royce players surrounded by Ford Fiesta parts.
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The season before we had mostly Fiesta players and did considerably better. As I say, it was largely down to attitude. If Emerson and Rav were as good as they thought they were we’d have been well clear of relegation even after the deduction.

As I say, administrative errors were made but mostly down to signing those two, in my opinion. The club would have progressed much more steadily and effectively had we signed players with better attitudes.
 
atypical_boro said:
Well they took us down, in no small part to their attitudes. They were the “leaders” of the team and they didn’t respect their team mates, that much is virtually indisputable. Recipe for disaster.

I was in my teens and went to every home game, I started watching us when we were a lower division 2 side. I loved them at the time like everyone else but having listened to every interview, every podcast, read every article and book about 96/97, those two were absolute poison. Emerson in particular a player who totally wasted his potential and admits it. Rav may have helped the club progress in terms of facilities but so would Vialli and he would have done it without destroying everyone’s spirit in the process. I wish we’d signed him instead.
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Rav seemed to have a point with his gripes, but we shouldn’t have pandered to playing him in the cup final when he clearly wasn’t fit. I blame weak management for that. Emerson with hindsight we should have got rid the first time he went awol, again weak management. The three points has been done to death, yes we should have gone, but we seemed to have fairly good assurances that we could call it off, Premier League as much to blame as us there.
 
atypical_boro said:
The season before we had mostly Fiesta players and did considerably better. As I say, it was largely down to attitude. If Emerson and Rav were as good as they thought they were we’d have been well clear of relegation even after the deduction.

As I say, administrative errors were made but mostly down to signing those two, in my opinion. The club would have progressed much more steadily and effectively had we signed players with better attitudes.
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I think we will have to agree to disagree again. ;)
 
the_dormouse said:
I remember reading the day after the cup final,Roberts saying he let the shot go past him because he thought it was going over. He also said "it dipped for fun" I remember being furious about it for years.
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After this thread I searched out the goal on youtube for the 1st time ever and I don't think Roberts was that far off his line, but he seemed to dive backwards under the flight of the ball rather than jump up & try and block it.
That action makes more sense if he thought it was going over and so was leaving it, rather than a bizarre non-attempt to save it.
 
Jonny Ingbar said:
It'll never be over in my head!
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Pity Ben Roberts couldn't say the same (almost)

atypical_boro said:
Vialli and he would have done it without destroying everyone’s spirit in the process. I wish we’d signed him instead.
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Robbo tried to sign him but was too late. Ravanelli was offered as a consolation prize.

atypical_boro said:
The club would have progressed much more steadily and effectively had we signed players with better attitudes.
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A perfect example of 'attitude over abiliteh'?
 
Rofesleg said:
Robbo tried to sign him but was too late. Ravanelli was offered as a consolation prize.
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I know, and the more I’ve thought about it and read about it over the years the more I’ve held the belief that missing out on Vialli was a huge watershed moment for the club.

If we’d signed Vialli instead, we wouldn’t have gone down, Emerson may not have behaved the way he did and we may have won trophies etc that season and finished well in the league.

Less chaos for sure.
 
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