Stockholm syndrome -the tories

FabioPorkpie said:
It’s thoroughly depressing how as a nation, we have seemingly stopped caring when our politicians lie, when they are dangerously incompetent, when they are openly corrupt, when they are transferring public money to their donors and chums, and when the media stop reporting it through fear of being cut out, or worse still, because a Tory ‘friend’ has been put in place to ensure there is NO impartiality.

If the polls are to be believed, we even seemingly reward all of the above!

Is the U.K. public the most politically naive/ignorant, easily manipulated population on the planet?
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This is an issue. We do seem pretty politically ignorant compared to some countries. Spain and Ireland for example, two countries I know well have much more politically intelligent populations than us. There are some countries that are worse: China, Saudi Arabia, North Korea and the likes.
 
Jimstewart said:
Alistair Campbell was on the daily politics earlier (I’ve got very mixed opinions on him) and he gave Labour’s form figures Over the last 11 elections. LLLL, Blair, Blair, Blair, LLLL. It’s probably no coincidence that Starmer has just got Mandleson back on board.
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It's shocking the PR done against the Blair years,and how easily the general public have sucked that up. Whatever metrics you use they were very good years for employment, economy, schools, nhs investment and pretty much anything else that people in this country say they care about.

Yes there were mistakes, but every leadership will make some. However the positives of the Blair years outweigh the negatives. The fact that those years were bookended by failed thatcherism and the poll tax riots on one end, and a decade of austerity and broken brexit Britain on the other just highlights that we've never had it so good before or since.
 
Laughing said:
Which is why the rest of us should vote tactically. On the subject of the tory love in from some sections, other parties clearly need to do better with messaging. Some of the attitudes to starmer on here just perpetuate a tory government.

For those not politically engaged you have to catch their attention. Labour are not nearly aggressive enough. They need to get a strategist in who will cross lines.

A poster with 140000 tombstones would be a start. It would quickly be removed but makes a point.

Every racist and mysogynist quote from Johnson on another poster.

Every broken promise from 2019 on another.

Every documented unlawful act on another.

If your a **** it shouldn't be too difficult to make the politically unaware, aware of the fact.
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I'd be surprised if Led By Donkeys don't do something and we should be able to help fund them.
 
boot boy ally said:
Speak for yourself.
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I don't. I speak for the country as a whole. A good example being if people were politically aware, we wouldn't allow the FPTP voting system to remain. What would be the point of having knowledge on a subject and allowing something that you know diminishes your power
 
BoroMart said:
It's shocking the PR done against the Blair years,and how easily the general public have sucked that up. Whatever metrics you use they were very good years for employment, economy, schools, nhs investment and pretty much anything else that people in this country say they care about.

Yes there were mistakes, but every leadership will make some. However the positives of the Blair years outweigh the negatives. The fact that those years were bookended by failed thatcherism and the poll tax riots on one end, and a decade of austerity and broken brexit Britain on the other just highlights that we've never had it so good before or since.
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This is very true, even Labour supporters have been so blinded the Iraq invasion that the good Blair and his government did achieve is just, at best, post script to their time in charge.
 
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SmallTown said:
I don't. I speak for the country as a whole. A good example being if people were politically aware, we wouldn't allow the FPTP voting system to remain. What would be the point of having knowledge on a subject and allowing something that you know diminishes your power
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I'm so grateful that we have someone on the board who is so intelligent that they are able to 'speak for the country as a whole'.

We are truly blessed to be the recipients of your words of wisdom.
 
The reason people vote for any political party 'no matter what' is that humans don't make decisions rationally when it comes to politics. Biases kick in and we start to identify with a tribe.
 
Lefty said:
The reason people vote for any political party 'no matter what' is that humans don't make decisions rationally when it comes to politics. Biases kick in and we start to identify with a tribe.
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This is true. My point is just thay other nations I have been in are definitely more politically aware
 
I genuinely think that the Red Wall fell not because the voters thought that the Tory policies were fantastic, but more that Labour had taken these areas for granted for far too long.

I mentioned it on one of the numerous Brexit threads last week, a lot posting on here will have decent jobs, comfortable lives etc ............. a lot of the voters in these seats won't have and don't see how their local Labour MP has tried to change this.

Rightly or wrongly, that is how I feel they felt when offered Brexit and the chance for change.

I mean look at Middlesbrough, Stuart Bell for how many years did absolutely nothing.
 
I believe we used to be more politically aware in this country. As I was growing up in the late 80s early 90s politics was everywhere and most people I knew grasped, understood and had an opinion, but I don't suppose turnouts at elections supports this and its probably just me looking back through rose tinted glasses and assuming everything was better in my day.
 
SmallTown said:
This is an issue. We do seem pretty politically ignorant compared to some countries. Spain and Ireland for example, two countries I know well have much more politically intelligent populations than us. There are some countries that are worse: China, Saudi Arabia, North Korea and the likes.
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I think people are numb and through lack of choice have become apathetic.
 
SuperStu said:
Who gets to decide this? What's the tipping point where the number of new schools doesn't outweigh 1 million dead Iraqis?
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The remedy for that was putting the decision makers on trial, not at the ballot box, especially since the opposition didn't oppose the Iraq War, but a significant number on the Labour backbenches did.
 
Voter apathy has generally increased since the 60's across most democracys, with a few exceptions, like Australia. To suggest british voters are any more uneducated than any where else in the world is simply innaccurate.

Voter turnout, for example might be a metric you use. The UK turnout is much in alignment with most democratic nations. Look at france as an example for really poor turnouts.

If you want to use education as a metric, in 2018 the UK was considered the best educated country in the world in a poll of other nations. For literacy we are ranked 14th in the world.

To suggest the british voter is politically stupid is... well stupid, and there is not one jot of evidence to back this up.
 
Laughing said:
Voter apathy has generally increased since the 60's across most democracys, with a few exceptions, like Australia. To suggest british voters are any more uneducated than any where else in the world is simply innaccurate.

Voter turnout, for example might be a metric you use. The UK turnout is much in alignment with most democratic nations. Look at france as an example for really poor turnouts.

If you want to use education as a metric, in 2018 the UK was considered the best educated country in the world in a poll of other nations. For literacy we are ranked 14th in the world.

To suggest the british voter is politically stupid is... well stupid, and there is not one jot of evidence to back this up.
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Depends what you mean by stupid and what you are comparing them to?

If you are comparing them to other nations, maybe not.

If you compare them to themselves ie their political decision making process compared to their decision making process in other matters, I disagree.
 
Lefty said:
Depends what you mean by stupid and what you are comparing them to?

If you are comparing them to other nations, maybe not.

If you compare them to themselves ie their political decision making process compared to their decision making process in other matters, I disagree.
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Nah Lefty, not having that. I did look and there isn't really a political iq comparison site. That leaves it as a matter of opinion. We are probably equally as dumb or as intelligent politically as any other democratic nation, we are just closer to our mistakes.
 
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