The end?

Andy_W said:
Interesting idea, but the detector would easily still pick that up, would probably act as a good target actually, and would probably also give itself away in other areas.
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More seriously, low-level drone swarms would be difficult to intercept if they're coming in below roof height.
 
Littlefella68 said:
Tucker - Putin

Probably get pelters for posting this , but Tucker Carlson been in Moscow interviewing Putin
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Tucker Carlson pretending he's a journalist. On Fox all he did was give his opinion and "ask questions". Nothing he is doing in Moscow is for the benefit of the American people.

This interview will be nothing but propoganda. Should be interesting what Pootin comes up with this time.
 
Andy_W said:
Yup, lasers will be the death of small drones which aren't big enough or stealth enough to defend themselves, at least lasers used in detection anyway.

All it will take is a laser scan of the localised sky, similar to a point cloud or how surface monitoring works in engineering nowadays. Kit <20k can scan an area 100m x 100m, from 100m distance, in ~30cm resolution to detect movements of 1mm, and scan the whole area in a second. So that could protect a box of sky of the same size, and pick up anything 30cm in size, in a second. Obviously you don't need to pick things up every second (which are slow, like drones), so you can use 10 seconds to increase the resolution or widen the area covered. 100m x 100m of sky, from 100m away will cover a significant amount of area which things would be coming from. They can do like 30,000 points a second, the last time I looked.

You could do 1km x 1km of sky, from 1km away with 30cm resolution, every 30 seconds. Good enough to pick up a drone large enough to carry armament. Mobile Lidar can already do this for surveys etc, but I expect masses of systems are being adapted for this for picking up anything in the sky (as opposed to no returns, which a laser fired into the sky would usually get).

Probably doesn't need a laser to shoot them down, and the tech for this is probably not close, but something like a much smaller scale phalanx, or basically an accurate auto shotgun could do the job. Doesn't need 50 cal rounds when a BB would take it down or damage it enough.

Laser would be better than Radar too, due to the better resolution, and much less range needed. You don't need a massive expensive radar, if you have portable laser detection, which is extremely cheap for what it does, and it's also tiny (shoe box size). Picking up a jet from 100 miles away is great, and necessary when they can air launch cruise missiles, but a small drone carrying a small amount of explosive needs far less protection and range.
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Yawn.
 
JackG said:
More seriously, low-level drone swarms would be difficult to intercept if they're coming in below roof height.
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Yeah anything low level has been traditionally hard to take out, it's why the Tornado was designed, and lasted so long, and why they often fly cruise missiles very low, even though the air is more dense/ less range etc. Thing is that may be the old way of thinking as it was more based on avoiding radar detection, which was basically stuck on the deck without a massive feat of engineering or local terrain allowing them on hills/ mountains etc. Sure, there are airborne radars but they will always be less resolution, and much bigger for the same resolution.

The thing about a laser detector is it could be mounted on a very thin/ tall pole, like a TV mast, and probably be constructed in a couple of days if they had to. Can't do that with radar. They're also great at detecting things looking down, it's basically what they were designed for.

The swarms thing shouldn't really matter too much either, as 100 drones still cost money, ones big enough and secure enough to carry arms have to surely be 10k plus, even tiny ones, probably even 100k plus. If a target is worth £1-£10m, then it's likely going to be better protected, so one laser system might be able to target most of the swarm, but you have multiple systems taking them out, firing basically millions of small pellets. As cheap drones are slow they would have the time to take them all or most of them out.

Then there's also jamming, shot range over a load of frequencies at high power as opposed to longer range with low power. You can get away with the shorter range, as the size of the explosive is smaller and much less damaging.

Basically as with everything, every time some advanced armament system gets developed, the development has come from a tech advancement, which is then defended by a tech advancement elsewhere. There ends up being no gain, it's just about who spends the most money, and how much the taxpayers are up for spending that amount of money.

It's not like some small time country can just buy 1000 drones with a small budget and have a seat at the big table. Sure they may get one half decent raid, but then what happens when it comes to defending themselves with pea shooters, or what happens next raid when they have nothing left?
 
SmogOnTheTees said:
If you've got serious issues with drone attacks, wouldn't a big electric fan be the solution?
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Haha, if it can blow faster than the drone can fly, sure, and to a distance longer than the assumed blast radius?

Probably would take the exhaust of the fastest jet fighter ever, and even then that would dissipate to next nothing over ~200m.
 
Some fun tidbits from last night

"Russian law
Russia has a new law...
It is from now onwards forbidden to lie to the President, and forbidden to withhold bad news to the President.
According to sources a familly member asked Putin what he was going to do about the high loss rate of equipment in Ukraine, and when he asked what high loss rate, this familly member (believed to be his daughter) flipped up the phone and started to show him the death of the column in Novomykhailivka in all its gory details, and continued with other places... endlessly.

He then called up Soyghurt, had "opinions" while thrashing his office, as his he learned that there's almost no equipment left and that this "demilitarisation" has been going on throughout the war, while being fed fabulistic tales about the numbers of Ukrainian equipment destroyed, and the lack of Russian ditto.

We do know that the law was made and voted upon in record time, and we suspect that at least something similar occured as the reason to the "why" of the law.
Just that such a law is needed is quite telling about how ****ed up Russia is.

Now, both Teplinsky and Surovikin was fired because they did tell the truth, it is sort of ironic from that perspective.
If either of them is still alive I suspect that those two will resurface sooner rather than later, at least Surovikin is believed to be still alive.

Russian general
We have been chasing hard evidence for this, but not yet received any, so take the following with a pinch of salt until confirmed.
According to sources in Ankara, Chief of Staff and Marshall of Russia, General Gerasimov have walked into the Suisse Embassy and sought asylum in Switzerland.
We have this from several ranking sources within the government in Turkey.
And when pushed the Suisse became cagey as ****, instead of calmly asking what the heck we are smoking.

Your mileage may vary, but in light of the new law in Russia, he might have caught wind of what was happening and danced the fandango in direction of Turkey.
It is highly likely that he would have had to serve up his head on a platter if he remained inside Russia, so it is sort of plausible from my perspective.
I will get back to this as soon as I have some sort of confirmation of him being a Suisse or Russian problem.

Russian refined statistics
Russia had 32 operational refineries at the start of the war, this is an astounding amount, even for a large oil producing country.
By refining their oil they got a far higher price for the petrol/gas, diesel, aviation fuel, and so on, compared to the crude oil.
2/3rds of their oil profits came from petroleum products, visavi crude oil, even though the crude oil volume was much higher.
This was the pride and joy of Russia, getting higher profits per barrel of crude compared to any other oil producing country on Earth.

Ukraine has attacked 12 of them successfully 17 times, with 8 knocked out completely and 4 that are partially operational.
4 of these are also functioning as oil/petroleum product export ports.
Those 4 are out of commission, at least for now.

This is akin to not only kicking your opponent in the groin, but shoting point blank in the ballsack afterwards and leaving him on the ground to bleed out.
Difference is that obviously Ukraine will continue with firing at the nuts of Russia, taking out even more cashflow, the 17th attack was yesterday, and you may assume that it will not stop anytime soon."
 
I am watching the Putin interview.

I read about Putin's history in the KGB in East Germany and mayor or St Petersburg etc where he developed his relationship with the mafia. He has seen a lot of foreign leaders come and go but he is still there.
He is clearly highly intelligent. Its intelligence that has been used to manipulate people for money and power. He is manipulating Carlson (as we knew he would); and he did the same with Oliver Stone.
He is a callous murderer. Even in the UK, he proved with Litvinenko, Berenovsky and Schripal that he doesnt care where you are, he will come and get you.
Its monstrous what he has been doing.
I think he got away with things for so long because he has had so much money put into the UK and US. There are lot of people in his pocket and I just hope that one day we get to see who these evil, greedy bast.ards are. Some very high up politicians got very close. The posh tw.at being the obvious one. When will we see the uncensored russian report and not the whitewash that was given out with all names removed? How about Starmer volunteering to make it public? We will see it in 25 or 50 years when everybody involved is dead.

But I have to say that I agree with Putin on one thing and I always have: NATO should never have been expanded eastwards. It was always going to be taken as provocation and used as an excuse - which it has in Ukraine. He reckons he asked about Russia joining NATO - was never going to happen but I just don't think NATO needed to expand following the cold war ending.
 
MoggasDog said:
But I have to say that I agree with Putin on one thing and I always have: NATO should never have been expanded eastwards. It was always going to be taken as provocation and used as an excuse - which it has in Ukraine. He reckons he asked about Russia joining NATO - was never going to happen but I just don't think NATO needed to expand following the cold war ending.
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So if an ex Soviet now democratic Country asks to join NATO to protect their democratic freedom from a psychopathic dictator we should refuse in case we upset him?
What garbage.
Recognise this?
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zzzzz said:
So if an ex Soviet now democratic Country asks to join NATO to protect their democratic freedom from a psychopathic dictator we should refuse in case we upset him?
What garbage.
Recognise this?
View attachment 71598
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It's my garbage opinion.

Nice. Of course, you are right, being the genius that you are.
I tell you what - send my your email address and I will run these things by you before I post them. I wouldnt want to embarrass you again and have you patronise me on a message board again.
Sorry. It must be difficult for you to maintain any close relationships when you are 100% right, 100% of the time. But its the cross to bear from your undoubted god-like intelligence.
 
MoggasDog said:
It's my garbage opinion.

Nice. Of course, you are right, being the genius that you are.
I tell you what - send my your email address and I will run these things by you before I post them. I wouldnt want to embarrass you again and have you patronise me on a message board again.
Sorry. It must be difficult for you to maintain any close relationships when you are 100% right, 100% of the time. But its the cross to bear from your undoubted god-like intelligence.
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Fair.
Garbage was over the top. Sorry.
But I disagree that we avoid helping those weaker than the collective good to avoid upsetting the Bully.
 
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