Another actual brexit benefit

Andy_W said:
You don't have to, that's fine, that's your opinion, which I disagree with.

Leavers, like the Tories, try and blame the pandemic for everything, and attribute nothing to Brexit, the running of it, or the bad pandemic management, it's ludicrous.

You could use every one of your character references, for those who argue against him, why don't you argue against those? :unsure:
At least ST provides some actual reasoning and knowledge along with it.

I'm not sure what your stance is, you claim to be on one side, but don't defend it, you defend the ones on the supposed "other" side. I find this a bit odd, considering the wide opinion of Brexit is failing, as it is becoming more of a reality to more people.

I've never met one remainer yet who has gone more towards the leave side since the vote, or who chooses to defend Brexit more than remain, in fact, thinking about it, I think you're the only poster I see doing this on here too.
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I defend the right for people to cast their vote as they see fit without being called thick, racist Scumbags andy.

I point out when people have blamed brexit for things where it is nothing to do with brexit. Timber shortages, hgv shortages, for example. I blame brexit where its too blame.

Brexit, or more accurately, the implementation of it, is terrible for the uk economy. It has left us with not enough people to sustain economic growth and made things difficult for smaller business'.

I don't particularly care about the limitations on travel and work, but that's more to do with it just not really effecting me,not affecting the general standard of living for the poor.

I do care about exploiting foreign workers so we can buy stuff cheaper. We should really stop consuming so much in any case.

I have often argued with people who support brexit, but don't insult them nor demand an explanation. It's none of my business.
 
Ex pfc wintergreen said:
I'm just not affected by them like most people aren't day to day..
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This will prove to be a falsehood. You claim I'm all about economics. I'm not. I'm pro collaboration with our nearest neighbours (well 27 of 29 of them) and freedom of information and movement between us all.

However lets loop back to the economics: We have been told our GDP will shrink by 4% long term specifically due to brexit. You haven't been affected by brexit personally (yet) and I get that, must brexiteers are also as selfish as you so as long as they are OK they don't care. However, the long term shrinking of the economy will have an effect on pretty much everyone living in this country. Every single person. Here is the rub, it won't be an even effect amongst people. The poorer will suffer more as the economy shrinks. There will be less money to support the disadvantaged. Less job opportunities and rising prices. The latter are already starting to take effect. This is what I mean by ignorant of the effects: you think, because you have a job and the cost of goods has only gone up slightly, that you are OK. What about in a years time, when the economy is still shrinking? Or two, or five years? How do you think a long term shrinking of the countries economy will affect everyone?
 
SmallTown said:
This will prove to be a falsehood. You claim I'm all about economics. I'm not. I'm pro collaboration with our nearest neighbours (well 27 of 29 of them) and freedom of information and movement between us all.

However lets loop back to the economics: We have been told our GDP will shrink by 4% long term specifically due to brexit. You haven't been affected by brexit personally (yet) and I get that, must brexiteers are also as selfish as you so as long as they are OK they don't care. However, the long term shrinking of the economy will have an effect on pretty much everyone living in this country. Every single person. Here is the rub, it won't be an even effect amongst people. The poorer will suffer more as the economy shrinks. There will be less money to support the disadvantaged. Less job opportunities and rising prices. The latter are already starting to take effect. This is what I mean by ignorant of the effects: you think, because you have a job and the cost of goods has only gone up slightly, that you are OK. What about in a years time, when the economy is still shrinking? Or two, or five years? How do you think a long term shrinking of the countries economy will affect everyone?
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The future is unwritten.😎
And a man who voted the Tories in showing concern about the poorer people is ironic indeed. You berate people who voted brexit yet absolve yourself of any responsibility for voting for the party who promised to get brexit done. Still IR35 was important to you so why not.👍
 
Ex pfc wintergreen said:
I was offered a choice,stay or go,I choose we go,the EU was set up as a economic free trade that came out of the iron,steel and coal economic agreement postwar which itself was set up to promote better relationships between countries and avoid future wars. The politicians were trying to make it the United States of Europe. It was never meant to be that. Incidentally I'm not ignorant of the effects of brexit,I'm just not affected by them like most people aren't day to day..Most people on here have to bring up data to back their argument, Or complain the local supermarket doesn't have a choice of asparagus.
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Things change and develop, we voted for the changes, approved them and wrote half of them, largely under Tory governance. The vast majority of the additional changes have been to the benefit of the UK, and certainly its workforce, along with human rights, tax laws etc.

The economic loss (or less growth), will initially hammer those worst off, whilst this isn't "most" people, it's the ones who need this crap least, especially not now.

As we're going to struggle with less labour/ higher costs/ slower deliveries/ slower lead times then the ultimate result of this is the cost of purchasing goes up, the cost of manufacturing goes up, and our sale price either goes up (or UK companies go broke).

If we sell/ export at a higher price than the EU and it takes longer, then who are we actually going to sell to? The EU will buy from the EU, the ROW will buy from the EU, this will hit UK companies most, and if it hits most companies it will hit most staff, so it will get everyone eventually. Yes there may be some who can take advantage of this, but that won't be "most", that's for sure.
 
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Flood said:
We should be giving ignorant, uneducated people like this a pass?

Your average Brexit voter
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Jesus Christ, what a racist idiot that guy is! I've heard crap like that many times over the years, it's ridiculous.

Without people like him, and people even half as bad as him, leave would not have won, wouldn't have even been worth counting the votes.
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
Well, we're all on keyboards so maybe.

I'm happy to call out racism on and offline; you may not be comfortable doing so, but I would like to think that most people are.
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Absolutely call out racism. Assuming someone who voted to leave the EU is a racist, thisck scumbag... Not so much
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
And I didn't say that, because I know that's not the case, but we all know that some people who did, are. There's no doubt some stupid and/or racist people who didn't vote leave.
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Stupid, is a bad insult, it's not a moral failing to be dumb, it's not even a moral faliing to be uninformed, large swathes of the electorate are not well informed.

My original comment was based on the type of insults ST uses and he uses them indiscriminately.
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
And I didn't say that, because I know that's not the case, but we all know that some people who did, are. There's no doubt some stupid and/or racist people who didn't vote leave.
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It's well known that the main driver for people voting leave was controlling immigration. It's a far extension to assume that some people who want to control immigration want to because they are worried about the resources of the country, the job opportunities for native britons. It's also fair to assume that some people want to control immigration because they don't like foreign people being here. I saw it for myself the day after the vote. The polish community centre in Hammersmith had been attacked. As the youtube video shows, some of the brexit vote was based on racism, or at least it's close causing bigotry.
 
Laughing said:
Stupid, is a bad insult, it's not a moral failing to be dumb, it's not even a moral faliing to be uninformed, large swathes of the electorate are not well informed.

My original comment was based on the type of insults ST uses and he uses them indiscriminately.
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I tired to ignore you today but here goes: You've justified all your actions on brexit threads around my actions. Do you not think that's petty and pathetic? To change what you think and hold argue different opinions because one man whom you've never met, has upset you on the internet.

@Andy_W Called it: you're the only person who claims to have voted leave who more often than not defends brexit. You claim you didn't vote for it and you don't like how it's been implemented. So you probably have to ask yourself, why do you see fit to defend it, to lose all the principles you say you have, just because I have upset you?

Don't you see how petty that is? You're consumed by your hatred of me. You've spent all morning justifying your posts based solely on the fact you hate me. Do you not think you should be better, and if you are the man of principle you claim to be, rise above petty hatred and dislike and actually defend your principles, rather then changing them in order to argue with me?

It's flattering that you think of me so much you have to spend all day talking about me ut you probably need to ask yourself why you do this?
 
Laughing said:
Stupid, is a bad insult, it's not a moral failing to be dumb, it's not even a moral faliing to be uninformed, large swathes of the electorate are not well informed.

My original comment was based on the type of insults ST uses and he uses them indiscriminately.
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Okay, there's plenty of dumb and/or racist people.
 
SmallTown said:
I tired to ignore you today but here goes: You've justified all your actions on brexit threads around my actions. Do you not think that's petty and pathetic? To change what you think and hold argue different opinions because one man whom you've never met, has upset you on the internet.

@Andy_W Called it: you're the only person who claims to have voted leave who more often than not defends brexit. You claim you didn't vote for it and you don't like how it's been implemented. So you probably have to ask yourself, why do you see fit to defend it, to lose all the principles you say you have, just because I have upset you?

Don't you see how petty that is? You're consumed by your hatred of me. You've spent all morning justifying your posts based solely on the fact you hate me. Do you not think you should be better, and if you are the man of principle you claim to be, rise above petty hatred and dislike and actually defend your principles, rather then changing them in order to argue with me?

It's flattering that you think of me so much you have to spend all day talking about me ut you probably need to ask yourself why you do this?
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I am not prepared to engage with you ST. You know my thoughts on your approach to debate, let's leave it at that.
 
Laughing said:
I am not prepared to engage with you ST. You know my thoughts on your approach to debate, let's leave it at that.
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Please please practice what you preach. BTW not engaging with me would probably include not whining about me all day as well. Let's hope, this time, your actions match your words
 
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