Forest`s points deduction stands [Prem Lg].
- Thread starter r00fie1
- Start date
Marvanelli
Well-known member
Not that we'll know, but it would be interesting to see if they reduced the pts deduction, if they were level with Luton, or worse case, below Luton in the table.
Much more easier for the PL to reject their appeal knowing Forest are 3pts above the dropzone with a much better GD too.
Much more easier for the PL to reject their appeal knowing Forest are 3pts above the dropzone with a much better GD too.
Forest are unbelievably lucky really. The 4 point deduction was lenient. They've only won 33 points this season. That total would have you relegated every year for the last 12 years. Haven't gone back any further but I'm guessing that total would you have relegated every season in the 20 team PL era.
Of course they could get to 39. That's unlikely. 36 is more likely if they are beaten by Chelsea and then beat Burnley. That total would have you relegated in around 50% of seasons.
They deserve to go down because of the football they've played. They definitely should go down with a 4 point deduction but they are probably going to stay up because of the total crap behind them.
Of course they could get to 39. That's unlikely. 36 is more likely if they are beaten by Chelsea and then beat Burnley. That total would have you relegated in around 50% of seasons.
They deserve to go down because of the football they've played. They definitely should go down with a 4 point deduction but they are probably going to stay up because of the total crap behind them.
gregorgregorovich
Well-known member
Blooming heck r00fie are you trying to get the whole of the East Midlands to hate us.
WilliamMunny
Well-known member
Some dubious stats there BG. 33 points would have kept them up in 2020-21 when 3rd bottom Fulham finished with 28 points and in 2013-14 on GD from Norwich.
36 points and their current GD would have kept them up in each of the previous 7 seasons, as well as in the 4 seasons before 2015-16. So 36 points and current GD would not have been relegated in 11 of the previous 12 seasons.
In 20/21 4th bottom was Burnley with 39 points so anything less than that would be relegated?
Depends how you look at it really.
But I used 4th bottom as the team you would have needed to better to stay up.
In your example of 20/21. Fulham would still have been relegated with 36 points. They needed 39 points to equal 4th bottom Burnley's total.
Same method used for the 36 point statement
Unravel_Morrison
Well-known member
Would any of the bottom 3 teams stayed up with 36 points in 20/21?
The 4th bottom total is the total that needs to be bettered to stay up.
Luton will not stay up unless they can better Forest's total who are currently which position?
Marvanelli
Well-known member
If you're 18th, and you better 17th's total.
You move to 17th, they move to 18th
In 20/21, if Fulham had beaten Burnley's (17th) 39 points and finished on 40 points, they'd have finished 17th and Burnley would have finished 18th. They wouldn't have finished 16th. 16th place Brighton had 41 points.
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ThatFragranceGuy
Well-known member
some people having a mare here 
starplayer
Well-known member
The current sanctions clubs get basically encourage cheating. There is no real incentive for them to stop either. I think any club breaking rules like these should be relegated at the end of the season. If they are promoted to the prem when they are relegated again should restart in League 2. As the championship would then have one less team an extra promotion place would be given to league 1 into championship and likewise for league 2 team into league 1
Billy Horner
Well-known member
But you're focusing on how many points the 4th bottom team happened to get, not how many they needed to stay up.
You're assuming that the past seasons are still live and, therefore, more points are still up for grabs. Depending on the total number of points of all teams in the league, and the size of the gap between the 3rd and 4th bottom teams, it might not even be mathematically possible to magic up the required number of points (there are a maximum of 1,140 points available in a 20 team league).
If you take it to the extreme, if the bottom 3 teams lose all of their matches in a season (apart from drawing games between themselves), then you would logically expect the 4th bottom team to achieve more points than average that season, as they would have 18 points before even taking into account matches against the other 16 sides.
So, the bottom 3 teams would end the season with 4 points each, whilst the 4th bottom team might end up with 40+ points. By your logic, you would have needed a record number of points to stay up that season, despite it containing the worst 3 teams in PL history.
r00fie1
Well-known member
No I'm not. I'm focusing on how many points you would have needed to beat one of the top 17 teams and therefore finish 17th or higher. And that was 40 in that season. Or 39 with a better goal difference than Burnley.
In 20/21 if Fulham had achieved another 5 points and got 33 points, they still would have been relegated. 33 points wasn't enough that season. Fulham were just well short of the 40 they needed.
Let's put a different scenario. If Boro had got 91 points this season would they have finished top 2 because Leeds finished 3rd on 90? Obviously the answer is no. They would have finished 3rd. Ipswich finished 2nd on 96. Boro would have finished 3rd. 97 points would have been required to finish 2nd.
Billy Horner
Well-known member
But Ipswich finished 2nd not Boro. And yes, they only NEEDED 91 points to do that (but achieved 96 points none the less).
Like I say, you're pretending that the season is still live and that teams can still leapfrog one another. You can only look at what actually happened and then work out the minimum number of points needed without altering any of the final positions.
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