ITV confirmation Number Ten partied whilst the rest of us locked down.

It’s easy to get sidetracked by the rights and wrongs of lockdown but in this instance it’s not the time or place, let’s focus on the facts that whilst people passed their last seconds away from loved ones and those loved ones were denied the chance of saying a final goodbye, the office staff of the Prime Minister and selected others were swapping Lynx and Hotel Chocolat gifts, playing party games, and having a Christmas celebration, I don’t know of any other organisation that didn’t cancel Christmas parties at that time but I do know of weddings, funerals and christenings that were broken up by police because they contravened guidelines.

There is no defence and yet again Johnson demonstrates a lack of leadership and excusing the inexcusable, he was not there, he may not have known about it but as soon as he was aware he should have taken decisive unilateral action, heads should have rolled and apologies issued, like Cummings, this will rebound on him and for the umpteenth time demonstrates that Johnson and the position he holds are utterly incompatible.
 
Zero evidence? Take the covid blinkers off. Cancer referrals are way down, cancer hasn't disappeared. GP's have been given permission to take focus off of the over 75's to focus on booster jab roll out. That will have an effect. The staggeringly high rate of non covid related deaths occuring at home. Domestic violence increased dramatically during lockdowns. The mental health of people grieving? Very sad yes. What about the mental health of people who were cut off from the world? What about the mental health of kids who weren't allowed to socialize friends and family? Kids who have been battered and abused at home and not picked up by social services as schools were shut, teachers having a keen eye on spotting any potential abuse that is happening at home. Have I forgotten Italy? No. I've also not forgotten the 'videos' of people randomly dropping dead in the street in China either (they are on the world wide Web if you haven't seen them yet).
Nobdy is claiming any of that, but what we saw in Italy is what happens if your health service gets overwhelmed which is the strategy you wanted. You've got a huge amount of supposition prejudiced entirely on your personal desire not to lockdown.....I don't want to lock down either, I'm not prejudiced in favour of it, I'm just prejudiced against overwhelming our health service and having thousands dying.
 
Nope, I'm not going to accept you alluding to Labour being as bad as this lot, it's pretty obvious this is one of the most corrupt and vile governments we have ever had....and no, not everyone broke the rules (not bent) and that isn't our fault for not doing so before you take that line

Totally right and it ***** me off when people try to deflect away from the Tories by bringing labour into it, this isn't about party politics, this isn't supporting a football team where you show blind loyalty this is about right and wrong. People were dying alone in hospitals and not getting a chance to say goodbye to their family, meanwhile the Tories were having a pissup and ignoring the rules they had written. It would be just as scandalous if it was labour, lib dem or UKIP running the country, people aren't complaining about this a petty point scoring exercise its an absolute disgrace. Then you see his press secretary laughing about as if its something completely trivial. How can they possibly hope to enforce any further restrictions if they're needed in the future?
 
Oh you know what I'm out. The pile on has commenced. Time for work. Lots of legal Xmas parties to cater for today. I'll leave you all to shout at the government but not take any action to remove them.
 
Sorry Laughing, but you have to take timings and population density into account.
The preventative measures and when the government put them in place should also be treat separately.
If we had gone down the Sweden route then our population density would have meant more infections and the death toll would have been much higher due to wider exposure of individuals and the complete breakdown of the health care system.
By spreading out those waves we bought a lot of people time, people who would otherwise have not had access to hospital beds or the improved treatment methods we have now.
I have worked throughout the pandemic while living with 2 people who were shielding and extremely vulnerable. If we'd let Covid run wild what would my chances have been to stay infection free and not inadvertently kill my family?
We have all suffered, but trying to retrogradely say we were wrong to lockdown is madness in my opinion.
I didn't say we were wrong to lock down Dood.

I do maintain that the why, who and when was wrong for lockdowns and how other countries have managed lockdowns proves my point.

On the issue of population density this was used continually during lockdowns to justify them by members of this board and shy away from a Sweden like approach of early adoption of masks, sanitised hands, social distancing and working from home where you can. Non of these were adopted until after the first lockdown.
It was a farce Dood.
 
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Zero evidence? Take the covid blinkers off. Cancer referrals are way down, cancer hasn't disappeared. GP's have been given permission to take focus off of the over 75's to focus on booster jab roll out. That will have an effect. The staggeringly high rate of non covid related deaths occuring at home. Domestic violence increased dramatically during lockdowns. The mental health of people grieving? Very sad yes. What about the mental health of people who were cut off from the world? What about the mental health of kids who weren't allowed to socialize friends and family? Kids who have been battered and abused at home and not picked up by social services as schools were shut, teachers having a keen eye on spotting any potential abuse that is happening at home. Have I forgotten Italy? No. I've also not forgotten the 'videos' of people randomly dropping dead in the street in China either (they are on the world wide Web if you haven't seen them yet).
Why do you think cancer referrals are down? And do you think this would have improved by letting Covid rip through the population with no restrictions taking up even more nhs resources?

Loads of medical procedures were missed because hospitals didn’t have capacity to cope with many things other than Covid, this isn’t a result of lockdown, infact lockdown stopped this being considerably worse
 
...and that's my point saying we are stealing the childhood from children isn't the entire picture, in fact it's far from it, it's about 2% of their entire childhood and stops them having to bury a parent or grandparent and go through life with the guilt of wondering if they passed that virus on.
BoroMart I am not going to start one-upmanship here. I am sorry it was so bad for you. I and my family have our own story to tell,as do other families on both sides of the argument.
 
Why do you think cancer referrals are down? And do you think this would have improved by letting Covid rip through the population with no restrictions taking up even more nhs resources?

Loads of medical procedures were missed because hospitals didn’t have capacity to cope with many things other than Covid, this isn’t a result of lockdown, infact lockdown stopped this being considerably worse
The phrase let covid rip through the population is disengenuous. Randy hasn't said that and not have I. See my response to dooderooni post.
 
Surely the main issue here is the hypocrisy rather than what the rules were or weren't?

We have all taken and are taking personal decisions every day while this has been going on; however we weren't and aren't the ones making the rules.

From a personal point of view, I lost my job because events weren't taking place; yet the people who enforced that were still having their own gatherings.

They talk of the Westminster bubble where stories only matter to people at the core of London politics. That isn't the real bubble. This cabal of politicians and journalists living in each other's pockets is the real one.
 
To be honest as shocking as this is ( but is anyone that shocked) the most damning thing was an admission from his then adviser ( Cummins) that when asked about the virus the prime minister remarked ( and was heard by multiple sources) as saying let the bodies pile high.

if this wasn’t enough to bring him down then what chance has this the latest scandal got.

 
The pile on has commenced.
Oh poor me, look at the bullying, etc.

No, you posted something that a lot of people will find borderline offensive based on nothing but your own perception with nothing to back it up but scare stories and supposition. Many things were done wrong during the "management" of the UK response to the pandemic but saying that lockdown was more harmful than not locking down is not supported by medical opinion or statistical analysis. I would argue that had we locked down earlier and harder then the lockdowns would have been shorter and less damaging, that a more joined up approach to sanitation and hygiene could well have further flattened peaks but that would have required proper leadership. This government has been nothing short of a disgrace but the lazy thinkers who label all politicians "the same" are equally guilty. I won't tell you which way to vote but think about your vote and think about the way politicians are behaving. Of course if you find Keir Starmer buying a field for his mother's donkey sanctuary abhorrent then you shouldn't vote that way.
 
To be honest as shocking as this is ( but is anyone that shocked) the most damning thing was an admission from his then adviser ( Cummins) that when asked about the virus the prime minister remarked ( and was heard by multiple sources) as saying let the bodies pile high.

if this wasn’t enough to bring him down then what chance has this the latest scandal got.
That statement was never proved is probably the difference.
 
To be honest as shocking as this is ( but is anyone that shocked) the most damning thing was an admission from his then adviser ( Cummins) that when asked about the virus the prime minister remarked ( and was heard by multiple sources) as saying let the bodies pile high.

if this wasn’t enough to bring him down then what chance has this the latest scandal got.


No chance.
 
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