HarryVegas
Well-known member
Full on meltdown in progress here, as the tide begins to rise on the small island which has cut itself adrift.
Racism.
- Thread starter Chris_Boro
- Start date
Same_as_before
Well-known member
All? Are you 100% sure?
Should there have been a referendum, No, was there a referendum Yes.
If you expect people to understand the detail of the EC you live in cuckoo land.
People voted on what they saw, the one comment I heard in the workies club I go in was 'whats it done for us' I never once heard 'send them home' you and I must meet different peer groups.
Should there have been a referendum, No, was there a referendum Yes.
If you expect people to understand the detail of the EC you live in cuckoo land.
People voted on what they saw, the one comment I heard in the workies club I go in was 'whats it done for us' I never once heard 'send them home' you and I must meet different peer groups.
Laughing
Well-known member
Adi and I don't agree on much but he is right about the referendum. We ended up with, almost, the worst form of withdrawal from the EU.
I voted to leave and wanted to remain in the customs union and everything that entailed. My vote and many others were hijacked to get Johnson into power and brings us to this point.
We really shouldn't be arguing with each other on this, it's pointless.
I suppose at the next election we may well get a mini referendum with tory voters confirming the last election and labour voters rejecting the hardest form of leave.
Nosmo-King
Well-known member
Watched this thread with interest. I worked on polling day at a polling station. It was a rather well healed constituency with virtually all being ABC1’s. A lot were quite happy to say they had voted to come out of Europe citing how the March to a one State superpower was not what they bought into.
Some claiming - quite rightly, that they originally voted yes in the 70’s - then known as the common market.
So it was the direction and increasing ruling from the EU that was the main motivator.
This was one constituency- and the majority came across as decently educated folk. I have done polling day duties before - yet never heard people wanting to share their vote and main reasoning behind it.
And Adi - don’t start on me- all II am
offering is a story from polling day!
Some claiming - quite rightly, that they originally voted yes in the 70’s - then known as the common market.
So it was the direction and increasing ruling from the EU that was the main motivator.
This was one constituency- and the majority came across as decently educated folk. I have done polling day duties before - yet never heard people wanting to share their vote and main reasoning behind it.
And Adi - don’t start on me- all II am
offering is a story from polling day!
Andy_W
Well-known member
Yes, it's necessary, as even if 5% of the voting population is racist, then this would have been enough to change the result of the vote, or at least the direction leave went.
Here's an example:
You must be having a laugh? 48% of the voters definitely never wanted a hard brexit (remainers), and a hard brexit was only wanted by about a third of brexit voters.
Basically, only 20% of voters wanted the type of brexit we ended up with, albeit one which wasn't campaigned for, that 20% of voters is <10% of the population.
Not having a vote on the type of brexit was absolutely ludicrous, especially when the option forced on us was the least preferred of all, the most economically damaging.
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Laughing
Well-known member
There was, undoubtedly, a section of leave voters who voted to leave the EU based on their then circumstance's. They felt they had nothing to loose and voted for change. They may have believed that immigrants were taking their jobs and social housing, I am sure many did. But, when you feel you have nothing, there is a much larger likelihood of voting for a change, even if that change is going to adversely effect you the most.
This section, probably need to feel the pinch before they are likely to change their minds.
One final thought, a vote to control immigration isn't the same as racism. If it is perceived that our social infrastructure can't sustain the high levels of immigration that the UK has always had, then you are likely to vote leave.
This isn't to say that the cause and or fix was to leave the EU. The cause was years of neglect to schools and social/medical care and had nothing to do with immigration, but not many people look any deeper than 400,000 immigrants a year.
This section, probably need to feel the pinch before they are likely to change their minds.
One final thought, a vote to control immigration isn't the same as racism. If it is perceived that our social infrastructure can't sustain the high levels of immigration that the UK has always had, then you are likely to vote leave.
This isn't to say that the cause and or fix was to leave the EU. The cause was years of neglect to schools and social/medical care and had nothing to do with immigration, but not many people look any deeper than 400,000 immigrants a year.
Adi_Dem
Well-known member
Asked and answered: see discussion with Laughing above.
An ignorant voting public fundamentally undermines democracy. I expect people to at least try and understand the thing they're voting for. If they don't then I will rightly criticise them.
I think we actually agree on more than we disagree on. I know we've had a couple of run ins and I forget what they were about if I'm honest. I will happily apologise for anything I may have said to you that hasn't come across in the right way or has been offensive. On this we wholeheartedly agree. The stupid thing is that I could have lived with some forms of Brexit. I would have welcomed the chance to vote on the version of it that we ended up with. I think it would have healed how I now feel which is alienated, ignored and left behind.
Andy_W
Well-known member
What is going to cause a racist meltdown though, is even the racists are not going to get what they want, and far from it, we are just swapping largely white immigration from the EU with the immigration of other colours and races from further afield, which will probably also be willing to work for cheaper rates.
Maybe we will have another referendum from the world, and detach ourselves to Mars and strike a trade deal with Jupiter.
Although I have seen plenty of posts of us leaving, so we can cut down on immigration.......from countries which are not even in the EU
This lot does need a geography lesson it seems.
Maybe we will have another referendum from the world, and detach ourselves to Mars and strike a trade deal with Jupiter.
Although I have seen plenty of posts of us leaving, so we can cut down on immigration.......from countries which are not even in the EU
This lot does need a geography lesson it seems.
Caesium137
Well-known member
100%, I didn't want it. But a much softer Brexit without this chaos would have been much preferable to both myself and I'm sure a larger percentage of the population would have felt their view (or part of it) was represented.
Laughing
Well-known member
To be honest adi it's mostly tone between you and I rather than the subject matter.
NYboro
Well-known member
I'm still waiting to find out where our Pacific coast is, given that we're trying to join the TPP.What is going to cause a racist meltdown though, is even the racists are not going to get what they want, and far from it, we are just swapping largely white immigration from the EU with the immigration of other colours and races from further afield, which will probably also be willing to work for cheaper rates.
Maybe we will have another referendum from the world, and detach ourselves to Mars and strike a trade deal with Jupiter.
Although I have seen plenty of posts of us leaving, so we can cut down on immigration.......from countries which are not even in the EU
Caesium137
Well-known member
All around Hawaii, we're getting it back so the flag makes more sense
.Same_as_before
Well-known member
Again I agree on the position of remainers by default they would want a soft Brexit'. But go to a council estate and ask them what sort of Brexit' they wanted. A large majority would say they wanted to be out. That's the problems with polls. Ask in Nunthorpe you will get one answer ask in Berwick Hills you will get another, ask me and I will say the moon is made of cheese.
Same_as_before
Well-known member
I think you are right. But fortunately almost 6m have been given permanent status.What is going to cause a racist meltdown though, is even the racists are not going to get what they want, and far from it, we are just swapping largely white immigration from the EU with the immigration of other colours and races from further afield, which will probably also be willing to work for cheaper rates.
Maybe we will have another referendum from the world, and detach ourselves to Mars and strike a trade deal with Jupiter.
Although I have seen plenty of posts of us leaving, so we can cut down on immigration.......from countries which are not even in the EU
Caesium137
Well-known member
It is a shame that generalisation ate your goat, otherwise you wouldn't be able to generalise...........
(there's another emoji from an adult for you to enjoy)
Adi_Dem
Well-known member
Then I will adjust moving forward.
Bloody immigrants! Coming over here and eating our goats. Makes my blood boil, honestly.It is a shame that generalisation ate your goat, otherwise you wouldn't be able to generalise...........
(there's another emoji from an adult for you to enjoy)
Andy_W
Well-known member
A lot of that could be to do with upbringing and education too though, i.e they are probably not equally well informed.
A lot also will end up blaming the EU for problems they have caused themselves, or have been caused by the UK or local councils etc.
A lot of the less well educated or vulnerable are easily led, the leave campaign specifically targeted them, they were very open about this.
Same_as_before
Well-known member
I will bite. What is less educated? My cousin without an O level with a very successful business, a bricklayer. My niece has a PHD , she has had lots of acedemic work published. Put her in a car and she would get lost finding Redcar.
A lad on here suggested voting should be weighted.
A lad on here suggested voting should be weighted.