Boro borrow £7m against Akpom transfer

BoroMart said:
It means that if we don't go up we will have to keep selling and keep borrowing against future income. Yes, it keeps the debt down but surely it highlights that Gibson is not covering the running costs anymore. I'm not sure this is a good thing, unless maybe he's looking to sell (or get outside investment) and doesn't want anymore debt in the club?
Click to expand...
Gibson doesn't cover the clubs running costs, the club covers its own running costs. Gibson funds everything "football related"
 

Research report: Still ill? Assessing the financial sustainability of football (2023)

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

The document is long and detailed, but worth a read.
The two tables need to be considered in context, but give a crude snap-shot.
Click on the link above ⬆️

1694681213033.png
Policy paper

Research report: Still ill? Assessing the financial sustainability of football (2023)​

Published 7 September 2023

Applies to England

Contents​

  1. Overview and objective
  2. Introduction
  3. Financial sustainability metrics
  4. Income based metrics
  5. Slave to the wage
  6. Operating cash flow (OCF)
  7. Current ratio
  8. Equity
  9. Football Net Debt (FND)
  10. Owner funding contributions
  11. Other concerning trends
  12. Conclusions
Still ill? Assessing the financial sustainability of football
Kieran Maguire and Dr Christina Philippou, 20 June 2023
research-title-dec-image.jpg



[Extract....]
22. The picture in the Championship (see Figure 3) highlights the concern around wage control, as overspending on wages is a prevalent strategy in a league whose successful teams get promoted to the Premier League[footnote 4]. In the 2021/22 season, 21 Championship clubs (88%) exceeded UEFA’s 70% guideline, with seventeen (71%) exceeding 100%.

23. Note that the three clubs below the 70% guideline were in receipt of parachute payments of between £34-£42 million from the Premier League........

1694680640345.png

1694680896336.png

...............
 
Ironops said:
yes its early days but some of the players we have brought in, on the cheap, just dont look good enough (Silvera stands out a mile for me)
Click to expand...
Way way too early to tell....and if a couple are utter flops, it kinda doesn't matter, what matters is that one is great and two are decent out of 12, that's the break even point.
 
BoroMart said:
Way way too early to tell....and if a couple are utter flops, it kinda doesn't matter, what matters is that one is great and two are decent out of 12, that's the break even point.
Click to expand...
Yes that works from a business perspective, absolutely - but it reinforces that every season we sell our best players and tread water in this league. maybe in one season out of 10 it all clicks and we get promoted - but thats a long shot.

It means we continue to be a viable business and have a club going forward, but it doesnt get us into the PL, to do that you have to spend a bit more money, especially when you now have the likes of leicester and Southampton selling 2-3 players for £100m and keeping the rest of their PL squads

Given its Gibsons club and his money he can do what he wants - and Im not knocking him - this new model may gaurantee we have a financially stable club but also guarantees we dont progress
 
Roofie's post above shows what I have been positing for a long time, re the state of our Club v others.

It is virtually impossible to fund a promotion campaign from the Championship without:
Parachute Payments - We lost PP's in 2019.
Or an owner who injects the maximum permissable under FFP - Gibson O'Neill have not invested equity since 2016. Another owner could have injected £56m more by now. £8m per season.
Or through selling an unrealistic continuous supply of high value players with low book value - MFC have sold 3 players at a £35m profit above book in the last year. They may have Factored, but that is a cash flow aspect only.

The club will not go up with a squad of this low quality, so will keep losing money and Gibson will have to keep his massive loans in place and increase them.
Meaning the attractiveness to a potential new owner of the club gets lesser and lesser.
The quality of the squad diminishes and the club get nearer League 1 than the PL.

It means we are stuck with an owner who will only loan in order to protect his outstanding loans, rather than invest to get promotion and change our revenue horizons and dependency on him.
We are as stuck with him as he is with us.
 
Paulh10 said:
If Gibson doesn't find an investor we will end up in administration don't know when but he is treading on thin ice.Not sure anyone will want to invest with the mess Boro are in.
Click to expand...
You are wrong. He knows what he is doing here. The finances in this league just do not work at all. They get tougher every season.
But there are a couple of clubs in the Championship that are on the edge. Big clubs that might not see it through.
 
indeedido said:
Roofie's post above shows what I have been positing for a long time, re the state of our Club v others.

It is virtually impossible to fund a promotion campaign from the Championship without:
Parachute Payments - We lost PP's in 2019.
Or an owner who injects the maximum permissable under FFP - Gibson O'Neill have not invested equity since 2016. Another owner could have injected £56m more by now. £8m per season.
Or through selling an unrealistic continuous supply of high value players with low book value - MFC have sold 3 players at a £35m profit above book in the last year. They may have Factored, but that is a cash flow aspect only.

The club will not go up with a squad of this low quality, so will keep losing money and Gibson will have to keep his massive loans in place and increase them.
Meaning the attractiveness to a potential new owner of the club gets lesser and lesser.
The quality of the squad diminishes and the club get nearer League 1 than the PL.

It means we are stuck with an owner who will only loan in order to protect his outstanding loans, rather than invest to get promotion and change our revenue horizons and dependency on him.
We are as stuck with him as he is with us.
Click to expand...
Gibson totally refutes what you say. Especially about the equity.
 
Whilst I am very much in favour of the club being owned by one of our own, I do not see the club progressing with Gibson in charge. We have him to thank for our past successes, but he is also responsible for our failures. We are where we are because of his bad decisions. That's fine when he has and is prepared to spend the money to get us out of it, but that doesnt seem to be the case any more.
 
fmttmadmin said:
You are wrong. He knows what he is doing here. The finances in this league just do not work at all. They get tougher every season.
But there are a couple of clubs in the Championship that are on the edge. Big clubs that might not see it through.
Click to expand...
Yes he knows what he is doing in keeping the club going, ensuring it has a sound financial base etc - in terms of getting us promoted, he may know how to do it but he is choosing not to.
 
uncle_rico said:
Hopefully some truth in this Danish chap wanting to invest.

I get that Gibson and O'Neil may want the club to be more sustainable, but there has to be some investment from the owners otherwise we will not progress.

The club has made far too many mistakes over the last 15 years and although our aspirations are positive, we will need to be very lucky to make it work.
Click to expand...

The club has made too many mistakes??????

Delete ’the club’ insert ‘Gibson’ - lets tell it like it is
 
iamborome said:
Whilst I am very much in favour of the club being owned by one of our own, I do not see the club progressing with Gibson in charge. We have him to thank for our past successes, but he is also responsible for our failures. We are where we are because of his bad decisions. That's fine when he has and is prepared to spend the money to get us out of it, but that doesnt seem to be the case any more.
Click to expand...
I think he is still prepared to and does so, but more cautiously.

The issue is Gibbo's wallet bought a European final scoring Italian international striker in the late 90's, in summer 2023 Gibbo's entire net worth would probably only have bought Brighton and West Hams best DMC's.

We simply cannot compete, at all.

We are trying this new tactic, but almost everyone is. We are unattractive to invest in whilst so indebted to GON, and I'm not sure how interested he'd be in relinquishing any control anyway. The fact he doesn't just write the debt, or a huge chunk of it off must mean he wants to recover some of it into his coffers on the PL gravy chain. Or there are financial reasons internally for PL/tax that it will affect that makes it unattractive to him.

We either need two or three of the best low cost transfer windows ever, where nobody leaves and everyone we sign improves the position they play in the squad, and then at least two of the parachute payment teams have stinkers too, or we need to spend our way up.

If we are penniless selling our best player every season to tick over whilst not losing Gibbo too much money, then so be it.

But don't then let your manager say the aim is autos.
 
I wouldn't mind Gibson running the club as a perpetual championship club that might have the odd chance of success if we get lucky if he was honest about it and charged fans fair value. He doesn't though. He acts like we're some plucky underdog punching above our weight while simultaneously charging the highest ticket prices in the league.
 
Paulh10 said:
his decision making has been quistionable almost embarrassing at times
Click to expand...

what decisions are you embarrassed about and quistioning ? - can you (without waiting for someone else) provide details of these decisions that have seen you become embarrassed whilst quistioning his judgement.

Players ?

Managers?

Staff?

Grass?

Seats?

Food?

Team Bus?

Kit Selection?



asking for a trick-cyclist i know.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top