Joey Barton in trouble again

BoroFur said:
Well just watch the video instead of reading the reports and form an opinion from that. If a Jewish person is offended by his choice of words having watched the video who are we to say that person is 'sensitive'?
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I have watched the video.
He said holocaust.
I questioned why the press reported it with a capital H.
I didn't say anyone is 'sensitive'.
Thank you.
 
Rofesleg said:
I have watched the video.
He said holocaust.
I questioned why the press reported it with a capital H.
I didn't say anyone is 'sensitive'.
Thank you.
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It's a perfectly acceptable word. Doesn't just refer to 'The Holocaust'. Probably a bit crass and daft for Barton to use it in that way but that's because he's not the brightest as I've already said. There was no intent to offend there. This is a load of fuss about nothing.
 
Mr_Fridge said:
Such a bizarre word to use in that situation. Struggling to understand the thought process to reach that point where that word is the “appropriate” one to use.
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I'm pretty sure Pardew (I think) said it on MOTD2 many moons ago, I think it was in reference to a poor display by a fullback getting done by a winger, something along the lines of "he's had a holocaust there".

So I assume it is something moronic scumbags with a Newcastle connection say?

🤷‍♂️
 
David Baddiel tells the one about a Holocaust survivor who gets to heaven and tells God a joke about it. God says “ That’s not funny.
The survivor says “ Well I guess you had to be there.”
 
TheYorkshireTerrier said:
Don’t think he should be sacked for it but definitely has to acknowledge how it could be offensive, and perhaps an apology.
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That’s it

If he has to, just clarify what he meant, that it wasn’t in reference to the Holocaust, but he was using the other definition a bit carelessly and then just move on.

It’d probably actually inform a lot of people that the word is not exclusively used for one thing in history almost everyone associates the word with. I’d wager a bet for that most people I know think the word has that one meaning.

Not that I think he really has to apologise for anything or explain himself but if he has to, then I think most sensible people would understand, if given the right explanation.

It’s really not that big a deal
 
"We got murdered today"

Yet no one died. It's just a saying.

"It was a war out there". Erm, no it wasn't.

Maybe Barton uses holocaust (lower case) as others might say nightmare? Not a word I would use, but there you go

Fuss about nowt. And banging on about trivial stuff like this does no good when attempting to address true anti semitism
 
Just because someone takes offence doesn’t mean you have to apologise. Otherwise we’d spend our lives apologising for everything.

everyone has a right to be offended.
 
I too think they’re been overly alarmist . If any manager ever said “we suffered a firestorm this afternoon “ although not the best phrase to use would that too be objectionable for the people of Dresden ?
 
"We got murdered today"
"We suffered a firestorm today"

Generic terms not specifically related to a single event or people.
Not sure why you can't see the difference.

"Otherwise we’d spend our lives apologising for everything." It's not everything, it's the Holocaust.
 
Craggsy2 said:
In the news again over a 'Holocaust' comment and asked to resign over it being considered an anti-semitic comment.

www.bbc.co.uk

Bristol Rovers boss Joey Barton 'should consider future' after holocaust analogy

Councillor Fabian Breckels said the Bristol Rovers' boss's comments were "appalling".
www.bbc.co.uk

A nuclear holocaust comes to mind when using the word holocaust, is this also considered anti-semitic?

He said:

"Someone gets in for a game, does well but then has a Holocaust, a nightmare, an absolute disaster."

Is it just me or is this being a little over sensitive?
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I think 'holocaust' when not prefaced with something like 'a nuclear' always implies that the speaker is referring to The Holocaust.

I do think though that it is a strange term of phrase. I'm not sure why he would use it when he then says 'a nightmare, an absolute disaster' - he second and third phrases are enough for us to understand what he means.

It just more evidence that he's a scumbag.

I wouldn't sack him or want him to step down (TBH all the other stuff he's done is worse and I'm not sure what he's still doing in management) but I would expect an apology and him to understand why it's inappropriate to use such a phrase.
 
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bumface said:
I didn't want to go there but since you've done it I'll just type this at the risk of sounding a bit 'Some of my best friends are black'. I have loads of Jewish friends. I moved to the other end of the country in my youth to live with my Jewish girlfriend and the only people I knew when I first arrived there were her and her family and her friends, most of whom were Jewish. And I'm still close mates with most of them. They hate being treated as a protected species by none Jewish people and they hate being used as political footballs and people being offended on their behalf. Most of all they hate being referred to as 'The Jews' as if they're all the same. They're not. None of them would be offended by what a nobhead like Barton said.
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I can imagine that what you say is correct and that is the attitude of the majority of Jewish people that might hear his stupid comment (y)
 
Caesium137 said:
I'm pretty sure Pardew (I think) said it on MOTD2 many moons ago, I think it was in reference to a poor display by a fullback getting done by a winger, something along the lines of "he's had a holocaust there".

So I assume it is something moronic scumbags with a Newcastle connection say?

🤷‍♂️
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The Newcastle connection is a strange one. There is lots of orthodox Jews in Gateshead so you would think that by spending any length of time up that way you might be a little more sensitive to such uses of the word.
 
MolteniArcore said:
I think 'holocaust' when not prefaced with something like 'a nuclear' always implies that the speaker is referring to The Holocaust that we all know of.

I do think though that it is a strange term of phrase. I'm not sure why he would use it when he then says 'a nightmare, an absolute disaster' - he second and third phrases are enough for us to understand what he means.

It just more evidence that he's a scumbag.

I wouldn't sack him or want him to step down (TBH all the other stuff he's done is worse and I'm not sure what he's still doing in management) but I would expect an apology and him to understand why it's inappropriate to use such a phrase.
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If I wanted to refer to The Holocaust I'd say The Holocaust not holocaust. Holocaust by itself is just a descriptive word ( destruction or slaughter on a mass scale, especially caused by fire or nuclear war. ) If any use of the word at all means it's offensive and the speaker needs firing it's use would have to be completely banned :whistle:
 
Caesium137 said:
I'm pretty sure Pardew (I think) said it on MOTD2 many moons ago, I think it was in reference to a poor display by a fullback getting done by a winger, something along the lines of "he's had a holocaust there".

So I assume it is something moronic scumbags with a Newcastle connection say?

🤷‍♂️
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Pardew's punditry on that occasion included the word 'raped' when describing how Michael Essien of Chelsea got the better of an opposition player.

No doubt someone will come along shortly to suggest that Pardew's comments were ok because he was simply referring to an act of plunder.
 
zzzzz said:
If someone on here used the 'N' would you take offense?
I would and I'd decide that someone else might take offence and challenge it.
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Now, I'm not sure why you can't see the difference between the use of the N word and someone saying 'holocaust, nightmare, absolute disaster'

One would be deliberately inflammatory and abusive. The other, as can be seen by this thread, at least open to interpretation.

I don't think anyone thinks it's a great choice of words, but plenty on here would take issue with recent government proposals to make protest illegal if ANYONE may take offence/be upset. I think Doods comment pays reference to that.
 
I assume if a media chummy manager or pundit said it there wouldn't be anywhere near as much fuss.

Whilst I hate the odious violent cretin, this does seem more of a case of playing the man not the ball.
 
Centralscrutinizer said:
If I wanted to refer to The Holocaust I'd say The Holocaust not holocaust. Holocaust by itself is just a descriptive word ( destruction or slaughter on a mass scale, especially caused by fire or nuclear war. ) If any use of the word at all means it's offensive and the speaker needs firing it's use would have to be completely banned :whistle:
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I understand that. I just struggle that people use the word outside of The Holocaust in day to day speech like that. I can't say that I've ever described something as trivial as a football performance 'a holocaust', nor have I heard anyone else do so. It's weird and maybe that in itself is why it does cause offence.

I'm not sure why people would also argue that it is important that Barton is allowed to use the word in this context. It's unnecessary.
 
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