Mandatory Jabs for NHS workers

TeaCider said:
Correct, they'd be an idiot if they work as a medical professional and are anti-vaccine.

I have a higher level of tolerance for people who are anti-vaccine who don't work in medicine as it's not their area of expertise, even though they're still wrong, but anyone refusing a vaccine who works for the NHS has absolutely no excuse.

I'm sure there'd be thousands of staff who weren't anti-vaccine that could help.
I'll try my best not to start dying before April just in case.
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I see, if they don't take the vaccination they are anti-vaxxers. Interesting. So for example, a consultant who specializes in asthma, let's say. Avails himself of the latest research and believes, based on research that the vaccination interferes with delivery of theophyline, so as an asthmatic chooses not to be vaccinated, is an anti-vaxxer.

It seems to me that people are so angry they just want to blame someone. A profession that put their lives on the line with often no PPE are the next to be castigated by folks.

I wonder what AET thinks of this and whether he would happily take professional help from a clinician, vaccinated or not?

How do you fil lthe gap TC and stop people dying from treatable conditions whilst you run doctors and nurses out of the profession?
 
'How do you fil lthe gap TC and stop people dying from treatable conditions whilst you run doctors and nurses out of the profession?'

Have any front line workers said that they'll leave the profession over mandatory jabs?
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
'How do you fil lthe gap TC and stop people dying from treatable conditions whilst you run doctors and nurses out of the profession?'

Have any front line workers said that they'll leave the profession over mandatory jabs?
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Didn't 50k+ care home staff leave for that reason? So would likely be a similar amount (or similar percentage)
 
Laughing said:
I see, if they don't take the vaccination they are anti-vaxxers. Interesting. So for example, a consultant who specializes in asthma, let's say. Avails himself of the latest research and believes, based on research that the vaccination interferes with delivery of theophyline, so as an asthmatic chooses not to be vaccinated, is an anti-vaxxer.

It seems to me that people are so angry they just want to blame someone. A put their lives on the line with often no PPE are the next to be castigated by folks.

I wonder what AET thinks of this and whether he would happily take professional help from a linician, vaccinated or not?

How do you fil lthe gap TC and stop people dying from treatable conditions whilst you run doctors and nurses out of the profession
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Asthmatics were one of the first people to have access to the vaccine because of the risk factor to them from Covid, so if there's a consultant that's refused the vaccine for a whole year on a hypothetical idea (which isn't actually a thing, you've just plucked it from the air), I'd very much question their mentality.

But there are already medical exemptions for vaccination, and those exemptions will continue when it's mandatory.

If you have a genuine medical reason for not getting vaccinated, nothing has changed.

If you don't take the vaccine despite having no medical reason, then yes, you clearly are anti-vaccine.

The gap needs filling regardless, I'd sooner it was filled with people who were vaccinated.
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
'How do you fil lthe gap TC and stop people dying from treatable conditions whilst you run doctors and nurses out of the profession?'

Have any front line workers said that they'll leave the profession over mandatory jabs?
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Equally how many of them have been jabbed v non-jabbed. Asking for a voluntary scaling back of staff in the NHS is an awful policy and would anyone be surprised if the government:

a) didn't know the numbers
b) backtracked on this like vaccine passports.

You can't just enact a policy, nor agree with it, without considering the implications.

Yeah they are idiots, get rid of them, is a childish point of view.
 
This will be catastrophic if implemented- which I don't think it will be.

The people most vulnerable will be the ones that suffer if it is.

I wonder what the workforce breakdown looks like for this? Anyone got any ideas? I cant find anything obvious online. Certainly where I worked in the past, regarding Flu Jabs it was often dentists that were quite against them (I appreciate this is ultimately anecdotal of course).



If they were serious about preventing infection in hospital they would look at the successful measures put in place elsewhere- declare it an airborne virus, provide adequate ventilation to all hospital areas and correct protective equipment. This is what is reducing hospital transmission of covid elsewhere in the world.
 
TeaCider said:
Asthmatics were one of the first people to have access to the vaccine because of the risk factor to them from Covid, so if there's a consultant that's refused the vaccine for a whole year on a hypothetical idea (which isn't actually a thing, you've just plucked it from the air), I'd very much question their mentality.

But there are already medical exemptions for vaccination, and those exemptions will continue when it's mandatory.

If you have a genuine medical reason for not getting vaccinated, nothing has changed.

If you don't take the vaccine despite having no medical reason, then yes, you clearly are anti-vaccine.

The gap needs filling regardless, I'd sooner it was filled with people who were vaccinated.
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And again you miss the point TC. What we know today about covid and the vaccine isn't what we will know tomorrow. We will continue to learn, and those at the bleeding edge of the science will know before everyone else. If they have a different opinion, should they be sacked for not being vaccinated?

How do you fill the shortfall? Try that one TC instead of venting your anger at people who try and save lives. At the beginning of this year 230 nhs staff had died from covid. Let's write that sacrifice off shall we because it doesn't fit neatly into your world view.
 
NYboro said:
I doubt it - home care staff do not have the medical training.
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Yeah that's true so the percentage may be lower, still enough to be a major issue though and health care assistants are basically carers based in a hospital, with little training.
 
Laughing said:
And again you miss the point TC. What we know today about covid and the vaccine isn't what we will know tomorrow. We will continue to learn, and those at the bleeding edge of the science will know before everyone else. If they have a different opinion, should they be sacked for not being vaccinated?

How do you fill the shortfall? Try that one TC instead of venting your anger at people who try and save lives. At the beginning of this year 230 nhs staff had died from covid. Let's write that sacrifice off shall we because it doesn't fit neatly into your world view.
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I'm not missing any point.

They're wrong to be anti-vaccine, your whole premise is "what if they turn out not to be wrong", when there's no evidence of that happening.

I'd also imagine the majority of the 100,000 people in the NHS in England who aren't vaccinated are at the low end of the pyramid, and are not involved in the "bleeding edge of the science"

The shortfall needs filling regardless.
Hire some of the billions of people around the world who have been vaccinated.

There's no anger on my part, just frustration at people trying to defend a daft position for the sake of "liberty".
 
Stepper_T said:
I don't disagree with that sentiment but JCUH is already 30% staff down on most wards so this could really be quite catastrophic.
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Well that's a can this government have been kicking down the road for a decade, it's their job to have ensured the NHS is fully resourced and they have dramatically failed and made policy decision knowing it would harm the NHS. Any rule to enforce mandatory vaccination would be a drop in the ocean of the damage they have caused to resource levels.
 
TeaCider said:
I'm not missing any point.

They're wrong to be anti-vaccine, your whole premise is "what if they turn out not to be wrong", when there's no evidence of that happening.

The shortfall needs filling regardless.
Hire some of the billions of people around the world who have been vaccinated.

There's no anger on my part, just frustration at people trying to defend a daft position for the sake of "liberty".
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Are you actually serious here?
OK you're entitled to your opinion, I am just thankful you are not responsible for enacting policy.
 
BoroMart said:
Well that's a can this government have been kicking down the road for a decade, it's their job to have ensured the NHS is fully resourced and they have dramatically failed and made policy decision knowing it would harm the NHS. Any rule to enforce mandatory vaccination would be a drop in the ocean of the damage they have caused to resource levels.
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I am not that convinced the shortfall would be a drop in the ocean Mart. It may be a smaller proportion than have been lost in the profession in the last 10 years, but where we are now means any shortfall would have a very significant impact on levels of care.

It's not always how many you loose, but where your current levels are that dictate what that lose actually means in the real world.

The tories are doing wat they did with passports and trying to "encourage" people in the nhs to get vaccinated. There is not much of a chance that this gets enacted next year, it would be political suicide.
 
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