promotion or win fa cup?

TeaCider said:
You seem to have misunderstood the OP's question.

It was "would you prefer winning promotion or winning the FA Cup?", not would you prefer the chance of promotion or the chance of the FA Cup.

There's no need to build for sporting glory in the question, it's either get it now or get the finances from promotion.
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That's what I was trying to say in a cack-handed around the houses way 🙂
 
FA Cup and another season to improve in the Championship before winning promotion.

May be financial beneficial for us to be promoted this year but I would rather go up stronger and have a better chance of avoiding immediate relegation.
 
TeaCider said:
You seem to have misunderstood the OP's question.

It was "would you prefer winning promotion or winning the FA Cup?", not would you prefer the chance of promotion or the chance of the FA Cup.

There's no need to build for sporting glory in the question, it's either get it now or get the finances from promotion.
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I haven’t misunderstood anything, I know and understand the question

I wholeheartedly disagree with your comment, you do have to build for sporting glory to win the F.A. Cup, just as you do to win a promotion these days you do not win a minimum of 6 games without having built a team capable of winning a cup, you will play at some point teams at the top level. I accept you can win one or two games and be lucky both in draws and ultimately against top teams, but to win the cup needs a level of ability and consistency. The last team to win the cup from outside the top division was West Ham (I think) in 1980. That is 42 years ago, so realistically to stand much of a chance, statistics tells us that you really need to build a team capable of playing in the top flight these days especially. As such, winning promotion gives a solid base to build from and try to sustain PL status and then improve and progress to try to win a cup imho. I am a pragmatist.
 
Straight answer to the OP…….FA Cup.
Against Chelsea with a goal straight from the kick off and another couple before half time (Crooksy) and then rather than sing “Can we play you every week” we can have the satisfaction of singing……..” You’ll be supporting Queens Park Rangers in a week……You’ll be supporting Queens Park Rangers in a week…..You’ll be supporting Queens Park Rangers……supporting Queens Park Rangers………supporting Queens Park Rangers in a week”!!

Mind you having written that, of the two, I’m not sure which one would give the greatest satisfaction!😀
 
coluka said:
I haven’t misunderstood anything, I know and understand the question

I wholeheartedly disagree with your comment, you do have to build for sporting glory to win the F.A. Cup, just as you do to win a promotion these days you do not win a minimum of 6 games without having built a team capable of winning a cup, you will play at some point teams at the top level. I accept you can win one or two games and be lucky both in draws and ultimately against top teams, but to win the cup needs a level of ability and consistency. The last team to win the cup from outside the top division was West Ham (I think) in 1980. That is 42 years ago, so realistically to stand much of a chance, statistics tells us that you really need to build a team capable of playing in the top flight these days especially. As such, winning promotion gives a solid base to build from and try to sustain PL status and then improve and progress to try to win a cup imho. I am a pragmatist.
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You clearly have misunderstood, it's a hypothetical question of which would you rather win.

The logistics of how it was won is irrelevant, that's not the question.

It's if you were offered winning the FA Cup or promotion this season, which would you pick?

We don't need to speculate about building a foundation to challenge for the FA Cup, it's already a given that it's won in the hypothetical.
 
coluka said:
You say that, and to a degree thats probably true, but if you think Gibson doesn’t want to try then what is the point in trying to win promotion in the first place. Most people on this thread are picking an idealistic dream that is near impossible for the reasons you say above. The best way to actually achieve it is to build and improve bit by bit. That in itself is a struggle, many a team fall by the wayside trying, as we ourselves well know. However, I bet if you talked to Delia Smith, Evangelos Marinakis, Maxim Demim or Denise Coates they’d all take being in the Premier league in 2022/23 than winning this years cup and being in the Championship next year. I am sure Smith and Coates anyway are long standing fans of their clubs too.
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That's confirms the accountant theory (sorry).

The club chairmen are looking from a business point of view but I'm still not sure that they'd not rather win the FA Cup than the play off final every few seasons. Maybe that doesn't hold true with the younger age group though, the biggest money winning game is the play off, as our press remind us each year.

When I look back at my time following Boro the games that stand outs have been the cup matches.
 
TeaCider said:
You clearly have misunderstood, it's a hypothetical question of which would you rather win.

The logistics of how it was won is irrelevant, that's not the question.

It's if you were offered winning the FA Cup or promotion this season, which would you pick?

We don't need to speculate about building a foundation to challenge for the FA Cup, it's already a given that it's won in the hypothetical.
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No I haven’t, but carry on believing that. I know it is hypothetical, I do understand the difference between real life and fairy tales. However, I live in the real world where fairy dust can’t make things happen, I am pragmatic and a realist. I would love to own a racehorse capable of winning the Cheltenham Gold Cup this year but it ain't gonna happen.

I would clearly pick promotion as it helps our chairman financially invest in order to try to achieve an era where we can sustain sporting glory, I thought that was clear from my earlier comments tbh.
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
That's confirms the accountant theory (sorry).

The club chairmen are looking from a business point of view but I'm still not sure that they'd not rather win the FA Cup than the play off final every few seasons. Maybe that doesn't hold true with the younger age group though, the biggest money winning game is the play off, as our press remind us each year.

When I look back at my time following Boro the games that stand outs have been the cup matches.
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No need to apologise as you are wrong in my eyes anyway. It is the only way to seek to challenge on a more regular basis and sustain a challenge year on year, that is the aim. We are lucky our owner is not in it for the money. He is in it because he loves football and wants sporting glory first and foremost imho. The mega money comes hand in hand with it and, you need an accountant whether you achieve sporting glory or not. You can never achieve sporting glory without being able to financially fund it at whatever level you operate at.
 
coluka said:
No need to apologise as you are wrong in my eyes anyway. It is the only way to seek to challenge on a more regular basis and sustain a challenge year on year, that is the aim. We are lucky our owner is not in it for the money. He is in it because he loves football and wants sporting glory first and foremost imho. The mega money comes hand in hand with it and, you need an accountant whether you achieve sporting glory or not. You can never achieve sporting glory without being able to financially fund it at whatever level you operate at.
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I don't agree with your pragmatist claim. I'd say you're more if an idealist when it comes to the Boro.

Those of us who recognise our limitations and are happy for a trophy rather than an annual relegation battle are more pragmatic. Gibson hasn't the wealth to give the backing required to get us to the level we enjoyed in the early 2000's, but we could scrape through somehow over the 5 required rounds to get to the final, there's a few have managed that.
 
Gotta be cup hasn't it.

I'm not sure the money angle of choosing promotion really stacks up. So the club has more money after a promotion, it just goes out the door on players and really it's no more reliable that they're any good anyway.

Look at most of the signings from Karankas premier league season or Monk the following season - Barraghan, Espinosa, De Roon, Negredo, Assomba, Fletcher, Braithewaite... would any boro fan anywhere have any of that lot back ahead of Jones? I doubt it.

Whether the clubs making transfers in 100ks, millions, or tens of millions, some work out and some don't so what's the difference?
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
I don't agree with your pragmatist claim. I'd say you're more if an idealist when it comes to the Boro.

Those of us who recognise our limitations and are happy for a trophy rather than an annual relegation battle are more pragmatic. Gibson hasn't the wealth to give the backing required to get us to the level we enjoyed in the early 2000's, but we could scrape through somehow over the 5 required rounds to get to the final, there's a few have managed that.
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Pragmatic in terms of how to actually go about trying to win the F.A Cup we all crave (Yes I would love to see Boro lift the cup).

I think anything else is unlikely in the extreme these days, pure fantasy. Even if we managed to beat Spurs tonight, I would still choose promotion. I am sure Gibson with the model he has in place is capable of getting us there, it wont be easy and yes might mean 2 promotions and a relegation are needed before a sustained spell, Villa are doing ok as are Brighton too. Once in that position you can build to be a cup team, we’ve done it once and can do so again.
 
coluka said:
I appreciate the point and as much as I love the Championship over what the first few years would be like in the Premier League, but if we could sustain our presence like say Leicester, who have proven it can be done (winning both league and cup). Compare our journeys since our League Cup Final, although I accept they are the exception not the rule though and to achieve it would be a struggle. I guess I have my pragmatic head on today though.
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Can see your point Col but I don't think Leicester are a great example of what you're describing really. They nearly went bust, dropped to tier 3, then got a big money owner and lurched all the way back upwards. Not a slow steady year on year evolution.

Heres a sobering thought about it. What if the choice was reframed as win the FA cup or be Burnley? Crap football but just enough to stay up year on year. Surely nobody looks at Burnley and thinks wow they're really building to eventually get a trophy.
 
Would love for us to win the FA cup but how many Championship clubs have actually won it?

Realistically it's highly unlikely we will win it. As somebody has said, to win it there's a good chance we will have to beat at least two of either Man City, Liverpool or Chelsea, unless one of them is knocked out or they're drawn against each other in the next round or the semis.
 
Burnley are a very good example of PL above everything else. Yes, they play against the big teams every year but they don't compete, they don't challenge, they float around the bottom of the PL virtually unflushable (perhaps this year?)

Do we want to be "Burnley"?

I mean really?
 
SuperStu said:
Can see your point Col but I don't think Leicester are a great example of what you're describing really. They nearly went bust, dropped to tier 3, then got a big money owner and lurched all the way back upwards. Not a slow steady year on year evolution.

Heres a sobering thought about it. What if the choice was reframed as win the FA cup or be Burnley? Crap football but just enough to stay up year on year. Surely nobody looks at Burnley and thinks wow they're really building to eventually get a trophy.
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I don’t believe Burnley are a good example, just an example. No, I would not want Boro to be run as a Burnley model, but I’m not advocating that and do not believe Gibson would want that either. Plucky Burnley seem a well run club but have built a low spend model to sustain status imho they seem happy with that. I don’t believe Gibson would settle for that one jot.
 
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