March for Palestine - Centre Square - 2pm.

Why do you think you can dictate to me what I should or should not agree with?
I'm not, but you were replying to my post when you said you do agree that without Israel, Hamas wouldn't exist.
I was merely removing any doubt that what you were agreeing to did not appear in my post and is not what I said.
Pointing out that what you were agreeing with was not my idea, does not equate to me telling you what you can and cannot agree to.
 
I think getting rid of Hamas is needed before we see a regime change in Israeli government. Others perhaps see it the other way round.

I also think most people hold four parallel views simultaneously:

- Anti Hamas
- Anti Zionism
- Pro an independent Palestinian state
- Pro an Israel free from attack from terrorists and neighbours.

I think the extremists on both sides can’t grasp those four positions and conflate them into a more black/white issue. I'm not saying that marches should necessarily be pro Israel, I'm just saying that all marches should promote the four parallel views which I've listed.
I agree with Parmoboy that there are extremists on both sides and to some extent they are feeding off each other, like we had in Northern Ireland.

Not sure getting rid of Hamas as an organisation will be possible. Its like saying we got rid of the PLO, but it was actually replaced by a more extreme group. The Israeli Armed forces may end up killing 20,000-30,000 civilians, but that will never be forgotten and will be on the recruiting posters for the next Group. Hamas has the support of Iran and sympathy from many Arab States particularly their populations.

Someone some where has to sit down and agree an amicable division of land in the area of the World that was Palestine pre-1948. Effectively giving Palestinians a strip of land the size of Birmingham is not going to do and saying thats your lot is not a reasonable settlement. That would be like the creation of Northern Ireland with just Belfast for Unionist/Protestants in 1923 when Ireland was divided up.
 
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Shameful.
"Context"!
Read and understand the history.
I`ve seen some of it - at first hand.
Over half the population werent even born when Hamas were elected and the Israeli military left the strip.
Collective punishment is a war crime.

10,000 murdered
30,000+ injured
Hospitals, schools, medical facilities obliterated.
Water , electricity, sewage treatment, food supplies, communication - all basic human necessities - cut off.

Shameful.

Hamas?

No.
The murderous Zionist regime in Jerusalem.

Open your eyes.

If you dont want to see.
You never will.

Good morning.
 
Israel and Palestine has been an unsolvable conundrum since it's inception, just after WW2. Hamas, and it's cause, is basically advocating genocide but what is disturbing is that not all Palestinians support, or have voted for Hamas but all Palestinians are paying a very heavy price for their actions. It's heart-breaking. I've stopped watching the news, burying my head in the sand to the situation, but I can't watch these poor people, men , women, and children, on both sides being butchered. There will be no winners in this conflict, only losers.

#UTB
 
Hamas probably thought they would get a reaction like this, but why do you insist on only looking at this problem as though it began in October this year? Why not go back further?

Zionist terrorist gangs have been active in this part of the world since the middle of WW2 and before Israel existed. There were two or three large groups, the best known of which were the Stern Gang, and they were bombing roads, railways and bridges etc and also attacking the British and assassinating our diplomats. They even appealed to the Axis countries (Germany, Italy and Japan) for assistance. That's right, terrorist organisations that purported to represent the Jewish aspiration for a national home were appealing for help from Nazi Germany in their attacks on the British at the very time we were embroiled in war with the persecutors of Jewish people in Europe.

What Hamas did was terrible but do you not think that these Zionist groups and then Israel itself with the way it treats Palestinians have not created the conditions for Hamas to exist? As Superstu pointed out, if we were invaded and pushed into a corner of Scotland we would rightly react.

I'd go further
There are some very serious allegations from normally reputable sources (Byline Times for instance) that Israel was well aware of what Hamas were planning. The BT allegation is they had 3 days notice of the 'very serious' threat.

The politics of this is just awful.
Bibi needed Hamas to have any chance of his leadership surviving.
Hamas need Bibi for their ability to influence Palestine even more.

So, they both got exactly what they wanted and expected - a reason to prolong the atrocities.

War and conflict are brilliant for leaders in distress, we have seen this time and time again.
Bibi cares about himself - not the innocent Israelis that were massacred. And Hamas care about themselves and not the innocent Palestinians that are massacred.

My first experience of meeting Palestinians was 12 years ago. From my naïve perspective I expected them to hold Hamas in high regard. I was staggered at the hatred they had for them and the continued damage they were doing to Palestinian hopes.
 
Not seeing many calls for Hamas, a terrorist organisation to release isreali hostages. Not convinced these left wing cranks and islamists are seeking peace in the region rather the destruction of Isreal.
 
Isn't that insane? I know we're all aware that governments practice propaganda and lie, of course they do.

But somewhere there must be some Israeli military officers, who sat around and planned out telling the world media a fake story that babies heads had been chopped off. There'll be journalists that knew it wasn't true and reported it anyway.

All to buy support and time so they could carry out this bombing massacre. Which is presumably happening just so they can expand their borders a bit.
This was never an official claim. A CNN journo picked up a rumour and reported as fact. Within 24 hours the befuddled old man in the White House repeated it - apparently freewheeling at the podium, and the Israel govt denied it - or at least found no evidence of it.

Plenty of horrific stuff from the 7th is verifiable as is plenty of horrific stuff within Gaza since then.
 
Not seeing many calls for Hamas, a terrorist organisation to release isreali hostages. Not convinced these left wing cranks and islamists are seeking peace in the region rather the destruction of Isreal.
Israel could end the 75 year old occupation of Palestinian land.
The "cranks" are those supplying weapons of mass destruction to the uncontrolable fanatical regime in Jerusalem.
Occupation didnt start on 7th October 2023.
 
I think getting rid of Hamas is needed before we see a regime change in Israeli government. Others perhaps see it the other way round.

I also think most people hold four parallel views simultaneously:

- Anti Hamas
- Anti Zionism
- Pro an independent Palestinian state
- Pro an Israel free from attack from terrorists and neighbours.

I think the extremists on both sides can’t grasp those four positions and conflate them into a more black/white issue. I'm not saying that marches should necessarily be pro Israel, I'm just saying that all marches should promote the four parallel views which I've listed.
Most people I know have no idea what Anti Zionism means or indeed Zionism.
 
I agree with Parmoboy that there are extremists on both sides and to some extent they are feeding off each other, like we had in Northern Ireland.

Not sure getting rid of Hamas as an organisation will be possible. Its like saying we got rid of the PLO, but it was actually replaced by a more extreme group. The Israeli Armed forces may end up killing 20,000-30,000 civilians, but that will never be forgotten and will be on the recruiting posters for the next Group. Hamas has the support of Iran and sympathy from many Arab States particularly their populations.

Someone some where has to sit down and agree an amicable division of land in the area of the World that was Palestine pre-1948. Effectively giving Palestinians a strip of land the size of Birmingham is not going to do and saying thats your lot is not a reasonable settlement. That would be like the creation of Northern Ireland with just Belfast for Unionist/Protestants in 1923 when Ireland was divided up.
There was a division of land but as always Israel wants more.
 
Not seeing many calls for Hamas, a terrorist organisation to release isreali hostages. Not convinced these left wing cranks and islamists are seeking peace in the region rather the destruction of Isreal.

Even Ukriane is looking like it will be pushed to negotiate a peace deal

Alot of people in the West will have a lot of questions to answer about why they didn't accept the peace deal last year

And the same will be said of this conflict
 
United Nations Record of Countries votes to Support a Ceasefire.

F-AQRKIbMAAQJEe.jpg
I am ashamed to be British and a citizen of a country which is complicit in murder of innocent civilians.
Our "leaders" actively fund and support the genocide as the corpses of women, children and the elderly are piling higher by the minute in Gaza.
 
Even Ukriane is looking like it will be pushed to negotiate a peace deal

Alot of people in the West will have a lot of questions to answer about why they didn't accept the peace deal last year

And the same will be said of this conflict

Not sure what the problem is with Ukraine negotiating a peace deal.
Putin will also be negotiating with them.
If they can agree - that’s great.

Biggest issue for me was why ‘the west’ waited for the invasion before supporting Ukraine. It’s not like it came out of the blue.

In fact ….It’s like…… they wanted a war

put it in the same file as Hamas and Bibi
 
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